Air: we know the pros, but do there secretly lurk cons?

IfIhadaboat85

IfIhadaboat85

Medium Fish
#1
Feb 10, 2011
81
0
0
Annapolis, MD
#1
So, like myself who is somewhat of a noob, I'm sure some of the others in here have learned some interesting math (if you want to call it that) when it comes to providing additional oxygen sources in your ecosphere. Air to me will never again simply mean oxygen, no. Now it will mean.. a little pump you pray is 'whisper' quiet, tubing (clear, blue, white, black, plastic, silicone.. etc.) suction cups to hold the tubing, valves, splitters, and every type of long, short, fat, skinny, bent, straight type of lava rock or 'air stone' imaginable.

We know the benefits of adding as much oxygen as possible. It's pounded into us throughout even the most basic of instructional texts and videos. However, what we don't know is.. are there any cons? If so, what are they? Are there certain fish species that do not like tanks with artificial streams of bubbles gushing to the tops of the tanks? Are there aquatic plants this can harm?

Any and all feel free to enlighten...
 

ryanoh

ryanoh

Large Fish
#2
Mar 22, 2010
858
0
0
#2
The only con I really know if is that if you're adding C02 to your set up, you're letting more of it out by using an airstone than you would be if you were not. I imagine that's true in general about the C02 already in your tank being produced by your fish "breathing." The only other thing I could think of is that there is such thing as "too many bubbles" for the happiness of the fish, but as long as you don't haves a jet of bubbles everywhere and there's room in the tank for the fish to get away from the airstone, you're probably alright.
 

ryanoh

ryanoh

Large Fish
#4
Mar 22, 2010
858
0
0
#4
I have a bubble rod going across the entire back of my 10 gallon, and I even had that when I had bettas and they're notorious for liking calm water, but they seemed to enjoy the bubbles. I don't think one of those is too much.

There was a specific video I saw once on youtube, and I can't find it now of course, but I'd say you don't have too many bubbles until you get this many, and I only say that because its rocking the water so bad.

This is something totally different, but I know that microbubbles are bad in salt water tanks. You shouldn't have to worry about that though.
 

skjl47

skjl47

Large Fish
#5
Nov 13, 2010
712
0
0
Northeastern Tennessee.
#5
Hello; I am on the side of having some sort of air bubbles in a tank. I have set up tanks with and without. One thing noticed when not having air is that a film develops on the water surface. The bubbles tend to break this up. That film may inhibit (a supposition on my part.) the exchange of gases at the surface to some degree and thus may offset any negative concerning the loss of CO2 (another supposition). The air flow should increase the dissolved oxygen in the water at the very least. The more densely stocked and heavily planted the tank the more important this becomes. I always have living plants. Living plants do give off oxygen under lights, but use it in the dark periods during cellular respiration and in the growth process. Bubbles create circulation in the water in addition to the now popular power filters. In the dim past my tanks were filtered by air operated devices alone. I still have a couple of very old, but functioning hang on the back filters powered by bubbles. I have used up a fair number of power filters over the time frame that these bubble up units have operated. Have any of you been around long enough to recall the Metaframe units that had a motor assembly with an exposed circular magnet that slid under the base of the filter body. The spinning magnet turned an inefficient and troublesome impeller. As much trouble as the newer impeller designs are, they are much better than those were. That is another benefit of air powered filters. They will not move a large volume of water, but are much more reliable so that it is not an emergency when the power filter breaks. I often run both types on the same tank. Also the filter medium is much cheaper to replace.
 

O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#6
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
0
36
#6
I only do planted tanks and the turbulance caused by the air offgasses too much of the dissolved CO2 in the tanks for me. Instead, I used sponge filters driven by submerged powerheads. I keep the output aimed at the water surface to prevent the protein film from developing. It causes a gentle ripple instead of a splash, and is therefore very quiet.
 

aakaakaak

aakaakaak

Superstar Fish
#8
Sep 9, 2010
1,324
0
0
Chesapeake, Virginia
#8
I have a 29 gallon like you with an airstone in one corner and a sponge filter in another on the opposite side. It's completely fine with a couple airstones or even a wand.

The only time I've heard of it being an issue is with CO2 injection.
 

ryanoh

ryanoh

Large Fish
#9
Mar 22, 2010
858
0
0
#9
No, its not going to kill your plants or anything. The only thing is if you start adding C02 there won't really be a point, but depending on your plant choice you might not need C02 anyways.
 

aakaakaak

aakaakaak

Superstar Fish
#11
Sep 9, 2010
1,324
0
0
Chesapeake, Virginia
#11
If WPG = or > 3 THEN

1. Clean a 1 liter bottle.
2. Drill a hole in the cap.
3. Shove some tubing in the hole.
4. Seal the hole with silicone 1 (not silicone 2)
5. Wait a day or two for it to dry.
6. Create a luke warm soluble (dissolved) mixture of
- - 1 teaspoon activated yeast
- - 1 cup of sugar
- - enough water to reach the part where it starts to slope towards the cap
* * There's a tweakable bubble formula in the DIY section for better ratios.
7. Add an airstone or bubble counter to the free end of the tube.
8. Wait a day.
9. Add tube with airstone/bubble-counter to the water.
10. Wait for bubbles.
11. Repeat step 6 every 20-30 days.

This should work. I'm too lazy to keep mine running so I just add flourish excel every now and again. The first time I did it I ended up with a sugar and yeast brick at the bottom of the bottle with what could only be considered rot gut moonshine water.

WARNING! If you get the liquid from the bottle in the tank it will kill your fish. Sugar+yeast=booze.
 

lauraf

lauraf

Superstar Fish
#12
Jan 1, 2010
2,181
0
0
Vancouver, British Columbia
#12
Or you can be lazy like me and buy a low-tech CO2 system - it's not pricey. This is different than injection CO2, which is super duper expensive and not necessary for your tank ATM, Dave. The most you would want is to dose liquid Excel - which puts CO2 into your water - or a simple CO2 system like aak explained above or I went out and bought.
 

O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#13
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
0
36
#13
And just to clarify, the carbon provided by Flourish Excel is not CO2, and is not driven off by the air bubble turbulance. However, it only lasts in the tank for about 10-12 hours, so always dose at the beginning of the light period for best results. The plants have to be using light to grow to be able to take Excel in. Also, there are a few plants that will melt with Excel.
 

skjl47

skjl47

Large Fish
#14
Nov 13, 2010
712
0
0
Northeastern Tennessee.
#14
Hello; I have not used CO2 injection. I have grown a lot of plants without it over the years. I may try it some day, as the notion is sound. Growng plants is slightly more interesting to me of late than the fish. Even with the loss of CO2 to the bubbles, I will likely continue to have a bubble source in my tanks. I will try to post some pictures of plants grown in tanks with bubbles and a power filter.
 

Attachments

lauraf

lauraf

Superstar Fish
#15
Jan 1, 2010
2,181
0
0
Vancouver, British Columbia
#15
OrangeCones said:
And just to clarify, the carbon provided by Flourish Excel is not CO2, and is not driven off by the air bubble turbulance. However, it only lasts in the tank for about 10-12 hours, so always dose at the beginning of the light period for best results. The plants have to be using light to grow to be able to take Excel in. Also, there are a few plants that will melt with Excel.
Click to expand...
Indeed, thanks OC - I made it sounds like Excel provides CO2, as opposed to carbon.
 

IfIhadaboat85

IfIhadaboat85

Medium Fish
#18
Feb 10, 2011
81
0
0
Annapolis, MD
#18
so really, as with the fish a lot of times, it's trial and error. I'm still probably going to get a hard water, tropical plant pack from thatfishplace.com and see who/what survives... but not for a while. Also, the ICH is pretty much gone so i'm in the process now of working on some decorations and slowly getting the salt back out and the heat turned down.. and trying to find a new home for my BALA... also giving the veiltail female betta to my Girlfriend..
 

MalcolmV8

MalcolmV8

Large Fish
#19
May 31, 2003
243
0
0
Visit site
#19
aakaakaak said:
If WPG = or > 3 THEN

1. Clean a 1 liter bottle.
2. Drill a hole in the cap.
3. Shove some tubing in the hole.
4. Seal the hole with silicone 1 (not silicone 2)
5. Wait a day or two for it to dry.
6. Create a luke warm soluble (dissolved) mixture of
- - 1 teaspoon activated yeast
- - 1 cup of sugar
- - enough water to reach the part where it starts to slope towards the cap
* * There's a tweakable bubble formula in the DIY section for better ratios.
7. Add an airstone or bubble counter to the free end of the tube.
8. Wait a day.
9. Add tube with airstone/bubble-counter to the water.
10. Wait for bubbles.
11. Repeat step 6 every 20-30 days.
Click to expand...
Just a warning for newbies. I did this years ago on my 20 gallon and you should be aware that when you bubble CO2 in the tank it does shift the PH of the water over the days. Then when your CO2 system runs dry and you get tired of making more and suddenly stop the PH swings suddenly and you get what most call a PH crash. The sudden swing of PH kills off most the fish in your tank. I learned the hard way :(
 

You must log in or register to reply here.