Breeding for fun/?profit?

[AndyL]

Figured I might catch some more eyes here...

My wife is currently out of work, and has become enthused about fish husbandry since our recent dealings with a angelfish breeder. And we've been looking for something she could do at home... And she wants to see some cute baby fish!

So here's what we're wondering... Is it possible at a hobbyist level (ie something that would fit in the apartment; 4-5 10gallon tanks) to make $ breeding fish (we're not looking for an income so much as just some extra $) But at the same time dumping $ into a failing 'buisness' won't help us buy a house anytime soon...

We were considering guppies, mostly due to the space and $ limitations (I can buy 8 10g 'starter kits' for the price of a 55). Wasn't planning to try anything super fancy at first (Probably just what we can get locally) once we get the kinks worked out, we'll get some of those fancy guppies you see on the web (those pure red ones are pretty cool!)

Andy

 

[Avalon]

Well, there are some ups as well as downs, but if there's a will, there's a way.

It's going to take time before you start seeing a return. Probably a long time. I would think that you would need to carefully figure out what it would cost you, and what you could make from doing it. Obviously, if you're not making any money and actually losing it, then this would not be worthwhile. The good thing is, if you were to specialize in something, say fancy guppies, this would be the way to go for a home-based business. An excellent reputation is a must, but it will have to be built. You will have to go far above and beyond what any LFS could do for their customers to give people a reason to buy from you. I would also think that you would need a website so you can market your product much more effectively. Word of mouth is crucial!

Chain stores have one thing going for them: large amounts of money and marketing resouces. Obviously, you don't. So, think of how you are going to separate yourself from this. Think of how you are going to take away their business! You will need to be an expert on your product. Also, you will need to consider if there is a market for your product. If it looks dim, then make one! If it's flooded, then consider something else. The fish market is increasing every day! Take me for example. I myself am not really interested in keeping guppies, but if I were to see some beautiful, fancy guppies that aren't carried in the LFS, then I might change my mind so I can get a "special" fish. It's the same way with Discus. People don't want the plain old discus, they want Snakeskins or Marlboro Reds, or some other exotic breed. Advertise in the local paper and invite people into your home to see your operation! It's one thing to read it, but another to see it. You can do this with the internet as well!  

This is just a few suggestions and ideas. It's going to take some work and creativity, but it can be very manageable if you make it fun! Good luck! Maybe one of these days I'll be purchasing some guppies from you!

 

[RedTurquoise]

Avalon pretty much sums it up! Try getting into something that isnt seen very once in your local pet stores. At least there will be a demand for them.

The first thing to do is import some very high quality fish. You will have to pay a good price for the first couple of fish but that is a must if you want to produce high quality offspring and it will pay off in the long run. The internet is the best source of info for that.

The second (perhaps the first though) is searching the market available, where can you sell them! If you can establish a relationship will the local petstores, that helps a lot because the petstores have a lot of customers. Advertising in the local papers also helps but there is one that is even better than all. Joining the local aquarium club will get your name out to people that already have an interest in fish and word of month usually works the best imo.

The third thing is to learn to cull. This is imo, one of the hardest things to do but you must remember that you want to build a reputation. That reputation is that you have very high quality fish not like the walmarts, petsmarts, big als, etc and when people buy from you, they know they are getting the best.

Another thing to remember always is that his is more hobby based than anything and there is not lots of money to be made. In the long run, you will be able to recover your expenses and perhaps make a little more. But dont give up, most people that do venture into the 'commerical' hobbiest do it because they love to.

Good luck and get us posted!  *thumbsupsmiley* *thumbsupsmiley* *thumbsupsmiley*

 

[wayne]

You're probably only going to make coin if you can breed something that most people can't, at consistent quality, and there has to be a market for it.
Guppies - maybe IF they're very good, else you're in competition with SE Asia/Florida bulk breeders. The unit sell cost of a medium or good quality guppy is so low you need to sell 1000's to get anywhere. To make any money on a guppy, betta it has to be so good as to be 'special'.
Tetras - see if you can get the holesale cost of these fish - can you undercat that - no. Don't try to make money there.
Convicts for example - easy to breed by the hundred, but you'll find there is a finite limit to how many agressive cichlids retailers will buy from you. My local market is flooded with sajica, price has dropped from 10$ to 3$

Good examples
Hypancistrus, everyone wants them, they're expensive, could be tank bred. Demand exceeds supply - they're hard to breed, only breed in small numbers and getting harder to find in the wild.

Apistogrammas - I've made on these. So much rubbish on the market, that get a good quality pair and you're ahead. Frequent, predictable,pretty easy, retailers always want good ones. People will always pay 10$ for good rather than 3.50$ for poor as they're so obviously good.

Aulonacara - get a good trio or harem of unusual, beautiful aulonacara or any other african lake fish (or anything wierd,high demand), get them breeding and count the money. Most of the nonwild fish in Europe are bred in the Czech republic by mom/pop operations like this. WARNING - no hybrids or rubbish, quality is crucial - people won't pay $40+ bucks a pair for rubbish.

 

[RedTurquoise]

Of course then there is always discus which bring in a good dollar. That is once you can get the breeding down pat. Just check the lfs and see what they are asking for discus!

 

[neomitrx]

I think discus & some of the others mentioned are pretty well out of the picture with a 10gal tank.

You need not only the tank that you breed them in, but several growout tanks to take fry at different times. Even with guppies, you will have to keep your fry until they are old juvies or young adults, because they have to develop their color. Not many people (until you get a rep & many even afterwards) are going to take young fry that have not even developed their colors yet.

Apistos are a pretty good way to go, for limited tank space and budget.

Shellies also, and kribs. But... you really need to know what you're doing with some of the fish... like the kribs, that need to be separated right after spawning.

As far as angelfish goes... yes, you can probably make a bit over breaking even, but you also need to invest in a lot more "hardwarë"

You ought to have 20" deep tanks for each breeding pair. Then you will also need pretty large tanks for growing out the fry. While they are not usually as delicate as discus in regard water quality, the fry will die by the scores if you don't keep the tanks clean. Not an easy thing to do when you have to feed them numerous small meals all day.

So, I really don't mean to sound negative on this, but as a hobby its really engrossing... as a way to make money, I think envelope stuffing is probably a better bet.

 

[kittyfyinc]

I asked today my small LFS if they would buy fish breed by me. They said once they are big enough to sell , yes.

Since I am only breeding fancy guppies and mickey mouse platys I wont get alot per fish. But to let them breed and not stop them, and get some money to take them off my hands is nice. I am not doing it for alot of money (wont mind it though)but I am trying to get money or credit to help supply the habbit and to let go the extra fry I don't need.

It would take alot of work and effore to make much money. I am just doing mine for extra money.Good luck.

 

[wayne]

As a further example I don't think shellies would be good as I don't think they sell that well - once you've sold local shops a few batches, you'll be swamped locally. Your only route then is to be regular enough to satisfy a wholesaler.
Ancistrus cats are possible though ...... or otocinclus

 

[RedTurquoise]

One thing to remember it that petstores may not give cash but credit for your fish. If you want cash, selling privately like friends, newspaper might be best.

 

[AndyL]

Thanks for all the suggestions folks!

I _think_ we've decided on a couple fish to get (once we find the right hardware, at the right price )

We're looking at some pretty wild varieties of guppies (Red albinos, and japanese (red or blue) glass).

Maybe Just maybe if I can find some good ones, I'm going to see if I can get some German Blue Rams (Might need some 20g's for their grow-out tanks, but thats ok too!) I have yet to find any up in this neck of the woods, but I've heard a lot of people asking about them.

Store credit could be good, as we seem to be watching a breeding pair of angels, 'hook up'. Still too young to breed (maybe in 2-3 months) so we've got time! So we may be looking for some bigger tanks sooner than later (Who needs couches in the living room when you could have a wall of fishy tanks right?)

3 different kinds of breeding fish might be a tad much tho, Might have to pare down the stock a bit. Selling shouldn't be too bad, I know the 2 petstore owners up here... Discussed things with walmart's manager (Hey, they'll pay cash, and would happily purchase locally!). Then of course there's internet sales, and opportunity to ship to the bigger pet stores way down south of us (Edmonton/Calgary).

Thanks again!

Andy

 

[wayne]

German rams could be a good fish to go for as they match all the criteria. Here's your problem - they're mega inbred, with lots of associated poblems. Some of these problems are nonvisible (small spawns, short life span....), others are visble - poor colours size, bentfins. Do your best to avoid this - try to gt fish from differing sources ,possibly even wild caught as your 'base fish' to work from.
If you go down to the fishstore and buy 2 or more rams to select a pair from, basically they're all brothers and sisters, the inbreeding continues, and do you think the weak, poor ones get culled out....no way. You'll produce weak, poor quality fish. Take a bit of time you'll get fish from a wider pool, less problems and they'll sell for more as they'll breed better, die less, get bigger and look better.

 

[AndyL]

Like I said, They can't be found around here (that I've seen) we'll be doing some mail order to get them!

Thanks for the advice, I'll see if its possible to find some F2/F3s...

Andy

 

[RedTurquoise]

If you come down for the auction, Im sure you will find German Rams. I know Dad's Fishroom carries them regularily and so does Big Al's.