CLOWNS NEED HELP!

[OCCFan023]

I came home today and took a look at my tank and everything seemed fine, but then I looked at my clowns and they seem to be covered in ich! Theres little white spots all over their body, WHAT DO I DO!! I cant get to my lfs till this weekend, IS THERE ANYTHING I CAN DO!!!!!! I dont know what the hell happened ive been doing weekly water changes, and keeping them well feed. I dont clean the algea away becasue I like its look so theirs a good amount, does that have anything to do with it!!!! Please anything that can help, I cant loose them!!

Ive been doing every other day tap water conditioned freshwater taop offs,

Also Ive heard of freshwater dips being used to help, is this osmething I should do???

 

[1979camaro]

are this in your display tank? if so you have a serious problem b/c it will not be possible to medicate whenever you get medication without killing all the inverts and such. based on what i have read freshwater dips sometimes help but usually do not (personally, i have not experienced marine ich...knock on wood). your best bet is medication or hyposalinity i believe...but again, inverts will be killed by either. is it possible for you to set up a quarantine tank at least?

 

[1979camaro]

this here is a pretty good write up about what you are dealing with: http://www.petsforum.com/personal/trevor-jones/marineich.html

 

[OCCFan023]

I can setup a small 5 gallon tank on my floor, but there will be no substrate or live rock or anything just heated salt water (at a lower salinity), I think Im going to do this right now so I can prevent any further damage. That article helped alot camaro, thank you alot man, I owe you one.


THe 5 gallon with just a heater will be good right, Ill go set it up asap and check back before I move to make sure its ok.

 

[aresgod]

yea as long as there is some filtration and maybe a sponge with bacteria from your main tank. maybe wanna put some PVC or something in there for them to hide in.

 

[OCCFan023]

well i got out my 5, and cut a peice of pvc from a fish pole holder so they will have some cover. I will be able to heat the water up nicley and add some store bought water and add fresh water to it to accomplish the hyposalinity treatment. I dont have anything for filtration for the 5 except a big rio that will be way to strong, as well as I dont have anything to seed the tank with from my established tank except maybe some sand, will this be a big problem? Ill post back very frequently to keep up

 

[aresgod]

well the sand would be a bad idea, how ick works it could already be on the sand. take a pourous sponge and stick it in your main tank for a while then move it to the QT. watch out that the heater doesnt over heat the tank. Maybe invest in a little hang on filter. it would be a good idea for future use.

 

[OCCFan023]

well i realized I can setup a qt tank, just dont have adequite materials... so Im gonna go with a freshwater dip mentality. I really wish I could do the qt but not looking good. Im gonna give them a 4-5 minuet dip and go from their tonight. Is this a bad idea. Ill try and setup a qt asap but its not looking good

 

[1979camaro]

the QT is going to be a necessity eventually either way...the problem is, as aresgod mentioned, the ich is already in the live rock and sand so unless you keep fish out of the tank for 6-8 weeks it will still be there when you re-introduce them = another outbreak.

 

[OCCFan023]

ok, well after some rumaging and moving some stuff, I found a old filter I could use on the tank. I stuck a sponge in my tank to get some seed, and set up a qt tank in my room. its at about 78 degrees and has same pH as my establised tank. I added the peice of pvp pipe and a 25 watt heater and the filter. I waited about a half hour to let the tnak warm up a bit and put the two clowns in. After I added the fish it was 9:30 and my lfs store stays open till 10 (for buisness people) so I thought what the hell so I went out to get some medication and anything else that would help my clowns, but I ran into a friggen car accident (awsome luck huh) so I didnt make it in time so came home. So the clowns are in the 5 gallon qt tank (with no medication). If I add medication to the qt tank and the clowns do get better (fingers crossed*) will the infected 16 gallon tank rid itself of ich because the parasits wont have any fishes to host on? the inverts wont be able to carry the ich correct so after time the ich willl go away and I wont have to worry about recurrences from ich in the sand bed

 

[1979camaro]

yah, usually i think the ich life cycle is around 6-8 weeks so after that time it should be gone completely

 

[wayne]

You're on the right track. You will need to keep them in the 5 for at least 6 weeks I'm afraid.
You will need to copper or hypo them. Freshwater dips are proven ineffective. There are other meds that are reputed to work, but not many, and not all are easy to get. Rid Ich will not work (snake oil), nor will garlic in most cases.
As clowns are a bit wobbly in copper I'd go hypo, and I'd drop my salinity over the period of a day down to approx 1.010 by taking out saltwater and adding pH adjusted freshwater. Watch your pH and kH! I hope you have a decent hydrometer and not a crappy swing arm as this will other wise be very tough to do properly.

 

[OCCFan023]

i was going to do the hypo technique, but as you said I only have the swinging arm type so I didnt want to risk it so Im just adding medacine. Hopefully they can pull through it. Ill keep ya updated. Thanks for all the help so far guys

 

[Cichlid-Man]

Well all i can offer is a good luck and hope things get better. The same exact thing happened to me, i now know the value of QT even after i buy from a reliable source.

 

[wayne]

I fear to ask, but what medicine?

The others I refer to that have a half decent rep are Kent RXP, which is tricky to use - you need to be on top of your water parameters, high pH, kH >9.... and also there's a medicine in europe that's designed to specifically whack ciliate protozoans and reputedly does ok but is not really popular in the English speaking world.

For you it is copper, or hypo. You should try to get a decent hydrometer anyway.

 

[OCCFan023]

well, despite all efforts to save my buddies, it failed, I woke up this morning and one was sitting on the bottom, and the other was declining badly. I left for finals at around 10 and came back now and I had found my clowns dead. Im extremly upset that my first saltwater attempt ended like this, but I guess I learn from my loss. Im gonna go do a big water change and stir the sand a little. I have skunk cleaner shrimp in their, is he gonna be ok or should I move him out of the tank, also will my inverts be ok while my tank restablizes (im gonna give it about the entire summer)?

 

[lordroad]

I'm sorry OCC... this just happens. I don't think you did anything wrong; it was just bad luck.

And there are always more clowns in the sea.

I'd increase the temp a bit in your main tank to speed up whatever ich cysts still remain, wait 2 or 3 weeks before adding new fish. Not sure what is a safe "hot" temperature for inverts, but I'm sure someone can help there.

Again, I'm sorry to hear about your loss.

I almost hate to ask, but how do you think your finals went?

 

[discus4everGrl]

OK - I don't have a saltwater tank but I do have The Manual Of Fish Diseases by Dr. Chris Andrews, Adrien Exell&Dr. Neville Carrington. So I looked up Marine White Spot/Ick

At 50degrees it can take 5 weeks for the life cycle however, at 70 Degrees it takes 5-7 days. However, it says to rid the main tank without using invertebrate sensitive medications you should wait 8 weeks. So if you can, turn up the heat in the main tank as well to speed up the life cycle of the cyno bacteria. As far as treatment - It recommends the same treatment I use for Freshwater for saltwater ich - formaline. This is very strong and should be used at a ratio of 200mg/litre or - 20 drops in 2 gallons for 30-60minutes. Formalin uses up alot of oxygen and should be used in a water change bucket with an airstone. It also recommends copper remedy and says a 4 week treatment of .15-.3mg/litre. It also warns not to transfer anything from the treatment tank back to the main tank such as filters, rocks, gravel, etc because many things will absorb the copper and it can leach out and kill you invertabrates. I hope that helps some - if not my bad.

 

[discus4everGrl]

doh- I just saw the baby clowns died. So sorry

 

[1979camaro]

i wouldnt go over 82 or 83 degrees