How to Cycle?

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riseabovethesun

Large Fish
#1
Jun 14, 2010
649
0
0
California
aquatic-underworld.blogspot.com
#1
I see it everywhere "Did you cycle your tank?!" And I understand the adding pure ammonia to the tank until it is at 5ppm then testing it for days/weeks until the nitrites hit 0ppm.

But, I've never cycled a tank before. *Gasp* I know you think I would've huh?! Well since I bought my 36 gallon wholesale/as is, it all came as it was and I've just added/changed/touched up everything since. My 10 gallon I got who knows how long ago use to house my feeder guppies, (which made some gorgeous offspring btw) and now it houses the betta, etc. During the remodel I kept water in the filter and used a lot of the same water, really only changed the substrate then ran the new filter and old filter on the tank until the old one gave out a month later. And I hear that was a good move on my part.

But I am working on my 40 gallon tank so it has never had fish in it and all equipment and everything will be BRAND new, so I'm just curious about the steps of a cycle and also how long it will take or anything I should know that is vital. I read the guide on the forum, but just want to double check, it really only talked about the ammonia and seemed super simple, but maybe it is?!

Thanks :)
 

T

Thyra

Superstar Fish
#5
Jun 2, 2010
1,891
0
0
Yelm, WA
#5
I am concerned about Option 3 on that site on cycling with pure ammonia. The way I read it is once you get Nitrate readings you do a 30% water change and your are ready. Ready for what? Some places I've read said add all the fish you are going to at once and others say a few at a time. And another thing - it doesn't say anything about testing for ammonia or nitrites again after you get nitrates. Isn't it possible to have either even if you have some nitrate?
 

bassbonediva

bassbonediva

Superstar Fish
#6
Oct 15, 2009
2,010
0
0
Northern Arizona
#6
It means to stop adding the ammonia once you get nitrate readings. Then you continue testing (and doing smaller water changes) until you have the desired 0/0/10-20 readings.

Definitely only add a few fish at a time. That way you beneficial bacteria have time to adjust to the bio-load. If you just dump all the fish you want to have in at once, you'll overload the beneficial bacteria (which are only established for the equivelant of 3-4 small fish) and throw your tank into a mini-cycle. Trust me, I've done it before. Not fun!
 

T

Thyra

Superstar Fish
#7
Jun 2, 2010
1,891
0
0
Yelm, WA
#7
The problem is that site doesn't go far enough and say what you just said. And also somewhere on this site I read someone saying there was no difference between a mini-cycle and a cycle. I am sure this whole thing gets confusing to many people. One of the places I read instructions even says that the big advantage of doing the fishless cycle with ammonia is that you "can add all your fish at once" instead of slowly like with the fish in cycling. The other confusing thing is the temp. Recently I read someone's reply to turn the temp down to hasten the cycle. Previously I had read frequently to turn it up (fishless). My experience with bacteria is they multiply faster when warmer within reason.
 

bassbonediva

bassbonediva

Superstar Fish
#8
Oct 15, 2009
2,010
0
0
Northern Arizona
#8
There are so many conflicting methods and statements out there because so many people have had different experiences with the different methods. What works in my tank isn't necessarily going to work in your tank. I've never read to add all your fish at once (and never recommend that to people) because of the potential to overload your beneficial bacteria. The concepts of a cycle and a mini-cycle are the same (there's the presence of ammonia that gets broken down into nitrItes which gets broken down into nitrAtes), the biggest difference is in how long it takes your tank to recover from them.

Edit: The reason I felt comfortable posting that link for riseabovethesun is I think that she is experienced enough by now to know how to pick and choose what will work for her and how to interpret what is being said in the article. If it had been a newbie asking, I probably wouldn't have posted the link. ;)
 

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brian1973

brian1973

Superstar Fish
#9
Jan 20, 2008
2,001
3
38
Corpus Christi, Texas
#9
bassbonediva said:
What works in my tank isn't necessarily going to work in your tank.
Click to expand...
Best statement on here..lol.

All of us do things differently and we all have our different opinions on cycling and tank maintenance. Fish keeping and forums like this are based on a wide range of various methods and opinions, the only real established rule is a tank must cycle how it gets there is a matter of preference and opinion.

The user missfishy has got what is probably the easiest to follow cycle instructions in a link on her profile. I didnt view the page Bass posted the link for so I cant compare them but missfishy's was the standard for a long time around here.

I do understand the recommending of adding a few at a time but to me it doesnt really make sense to my logic. If I cycle and have established bacteria and add 3 fish then wait a couple days, the existing bacteria colony is going to be able to handle 3 fish, any excess will die off due to starvation, well when I add 3 more fish later it is still going to take 8+ hours for that bacteria to come up to the level to handle those extra fish and for those bacteria to come up your going to have to have some excess ammonia and nitrite right?? So does it really make a difference how quickly you add the fish.. I honestly dont know.
 

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prsturm

prsturm

Large Fish
#12
Aug 13, 2010
100
0
0
#12
You are correct. NO2 is a negatively charged ion. This makes it more reactive as it searches to bond with other atoms to stabilize it's electron load. NO3 is a a more stable form, though it still carries a negative charge. NO2 more readily bonds with organic material, causing problems with fish in their gills and tissues. NO3 bonds much less readily (though it still can), so it isn't as "toxic".
 

brian1973

brian1973

Superstar Fish
#13
Jan 20, 2008
2,001
3
38
Corpus Christi, Texas
#13
Ok I went back and read it again.. she is referring to the Bacteria that consume the ammonia, these are the bacteria that produce nitrites, correct? In my opinion her terminology of nitrite bacteria is correct is the sense she is using it.

Remember she states. "The Simplest Cycling Explanation EVER"
 

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T

Thyra

Superstar Fish
#14
Jun 2, 2010
1,891
0
0
Yelm, WA
#14
Okay, I agree Brian. Actually I agree with all of you. It was just that some place a while back when I was new to the forum, someone ask where the bacteria came from and everyone that responded said it was a good question and no one had a real answer except from the "atmosphere."
 

bassbonediva

bassbonediva

Superstar Fish
#15
Oct 15, 2009
2,010
0
0
Northern Arizona
#15
I believe you could say that bacteria is present everywhere, it just requires the right catalyst to start its life cycle. In the case of aquariums, the ammonia that is introduced through fish waste and decaying organic matter (such as food) is the catalyst that starts the life cycle of the bacteria that breaks ammonia down into nitrite. Once nitrite is present, it becomes the catalyst that starts the life cycle of the bacteria that breaks the nitrite down in to nitrate. Without the presence of either catalyst (or an unbalanced ratio of the two), the bacteria start to die out, which is why it is important if you are not going to have fish in your tank for more than an hour or two, to 1-keep your media moist and 2-provide it with some food source, in this case ammonia, to keep it alive, whether that's by putting it into another tank or putting it into whatever container your fish are in.
 

bassbonediva

bassbonediva

Superstar Fish
#17
Oct 15, 2009
2,010
0
0
Northern Arizona
#17
Would you believe that was typed at 10:30 at night having been up since 5am? lol. In other words, I'm not sure how that ended up making sense because I was about to pass out I was so tired (only had about 3 hours of sleep the night before). :p

I'd like to add that the last part of my explanation can help understand why adding fish gradually is important. If you dump all the fish in at once, there's an explosion of ammonia which the nitrifying bacteria aren't prepared to compensate for and it takes longer for it to catch up, so your fish are living in ammonia and nitrites unless you're doing large daily water changes to make up for the lack of beneficial bacteria. If you add the fish gradually, the bacteria has a chance to catch up quickly and you have less work on your hands. Also, it gives you time to see if there's going to be any aggression (depending on what fish you're adding) and deal with it while you have a small group, rather than having to worry about all these fish that don't know each other all of a sudden being dumped together and stressed.
 

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