I need some help...

[pigs_fly]

Ok everyone, its me again....with yet another problem. And I am apologizing ahead of time, because this is going to be an extremely lengthy post Ok, so, my betta. He has been doing great until Friday (the 3rd). That is when he started to not look so hot. Lotus gave me a link about betta diseases, etc. and that helped me to narrow things down as to what might be wrong with him. His fins were clumped (i.e. they werent fanned like a happy, healthy betta), and his gills were red, and he was extremely lethargic - this all occured after the temperature of his tank had elevated to 86F (for an explanation see "Fuzzy stuff.....sick fish?"). So, i was thinking he had "simply" been overheated.....aka: was being cooked to death!! And, according the website, he didnt have any other visible disease, but was showing signs of depression...I purchased an amonia water test kit, a nitrite water test kit, and a nitrate water test kit (Line: Nutrafin, Distributor/Company: Hagen) - the kind with the test tubes and dropper bottles. Everything seemed to checked out ok (NH3: 0-.1mg/L; NO2: less than .1mg/L; and NO3: 5-10mg/L ). But, even still, I did my weekly water change (about 25-30%) Saturday night (using my usual RO water and stresszyme) and I used an aquarium sponge to clean the sides of tank a little bit (I had some algae growing). That seemed to help with his mood. He started to swim around more actively the next day and was looking great - no more red gills and his fins were fanned . He was also eating quite heartily which was an amazing improvment from Friday when he wouldnt touch a nip of food (Saturday morning he did eat but he threw it all up about 5min later, this was before i did the water change - that was done saturday night). He ate this morning, which is good, but he looks soooo bad right now. He is rather lethargic again and his fins are all clumped together again, his gills are now splotchy bright red (not completely red, just patches), he seems to be struggling for air - almost like he is suffocating, because he will be towards the bottom of the tank and start flarring his gills extrememly (at 90 degree angles) and then swim around kind of crazed and finally find the surface and take huge gulps of air....now i know that is not good. I have the top of his tank slightly removed to allow for more surface air, hoping that maybe that is the problem...I'm at a loss as to what I should do now. Could it be a parasite of some sort? Is there something wrong with my water quality? pH? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Again, sorry this is so lengthy, I just wanted to try to give yall everything you needed to know now so that you dont have to keep asking later Thanks.

 

[echoofformless]

What size tank is this, what sort of filtration, etc.

If you have no ammonia and no nitrite and only a small amount of nitrate, than your water is basically good. I assume since it's RO that the pH is around 7 or so. Bettas like anything from 6.4-7.6.

Now the temperature matters more if it's steady than a particular degree reading. BUT bettas do best in anything above 70 and below 85. The 86 might tick him off a little, but it wouldn't lead to any stress worth worrying about.


My only assumption, being as though the water parameters are good, is that perhaps it is some sort of an illness that hasn't run its course or been cured. Other than that I might mention that RO water is weak in mineral content. He might be missing out on something due to that fact.

 

[pigs_fly]

My tank is about 1.5 gallons; it has ummm, i dont really know what to call the filtration system, but it has a cylinder coming up from the bottom of the tank (kinda in the middle) and then I have an airstone at the base of the cylinder and a carbon filter attached to the top of the cylinder.....The reason i use the RO water is because, no other water has been able to keep my fish alive I tired treating my tap water, and then i tried using bottled water, and this is the only thing that has worked so far...If he is sick (i cant determine any specific kind of illness..) is there any general kind of meds that i could treat him with? Thanks for your thoughts and ideas. He is looking even worse now though, he is resting kind of tilted to one side on the bottom of the tank....i really dont want to lose this one - i like him

EDIT: should i try putting a fresh filter in?

 

[homebunnyj]

If you post up in the betta forum, you might catch some of the betta people a lot sooner. I know you are very anxious.
Sounds like he may be having trouble breathing. Try a complete water change, being sure to match the temp. If he's been happy and healthy in the water supply you've been using, fine. If not, maybe you might mix a little tap water in with it; I recall your tap water isn't very good, thus the RO water.
Google 'betta diseases' or betta illness and read several sites, not just the one. Do a really close visual inspection in good bright light, looking for anything abnormal... spots, color changes, changes in body size or shape, fin or scale abnormalities, lesions, unidentified 'things' anywhere on him. Look at his gills for anything unusual, maybe some sort of parasites or something. Has he been 'flashing'-- rubbing himself on the bottom or sides of the tank, or plants or ornaments? suddenly darting around? sitting on the bottom/ staying at the top? These may clue you in to what the problem is as you read.
Good luck. Keep us posted.

 

[pigs_fly]

Thanks homebunnyj, ill try posting in the betta forum. for the full water change, would i just cup out the old water and then pour in the new water - no rinsing of the gravel or anything like that? there is definitely a color change in his gills - the blood red splotches (like the red when our eyes our blood shot..)i have been tyring to get a good look at his all over appearance from the get go, and i havent noticed anything aside form the gills, except for i think his "stomach" (his inner gut) appears to be kind of dark...darker than i remember it being when i first got him. he hasnt really been rubbing, but he does sit on the top/bottom of the tank, and he is definitely having trouble breathing (at least it appears that way), the only darting swimming is like i mentioned above, that he appears to freak out and its as if he cant find the surface of the water to get air....thanks for you suggestions

EDIT: could the minimal algae cause this?

 

[wonghee76]

helo...

i recall that u have the activated carbon as filter, did u change the carbon every 2 week time? as the carbon is good at absorbing the toxic but also will release it after 2 week, may b that is the problem? just some sugestion.

according to the sympthom u decribe, ur fish may suffer form gill flukes that is a parasites or a internal bacteria. try add some salt to it, 3-5g / liter, it may help a bit, if the fish realy no infection, the salt at this level also should not kill it.

hope that this can help*celebrate

let me know the progress of ur fish

thanks you

Hee

 

[pigs_fly]

thanks! i didnt realize i needed to change the filter every two weeks! Ill do that right away! and yes, i was thinking it was gill flukes too, i will try the salt or some other form of anitbiotic...thanks! (ive moved this post the the betta forum - "HELP!")

 

[Etheostoma]

The carbon won't release toxins that are sorbed to it. It will quit working when full, however.

I can't say as I use carbon regularly in any of my tanks, only in response to clarity issues that occasionally turn up with renovation. You shouldn't need to either in a 1.5g with one betta.

 

[wonghee76]

hai...

need to clarify the "release of toxic from activated carbon" issue, here is the quotation from one of the article
http://www.fritzpet.com/carbon.html

"companies offer you a product made up of peat and lignite. This material has very few pores, and the pores it has are very large (macropores). This carbon provides much less total surface area, so it removes less discoloration (caused by phenols). It’s also slow to adsorb organics and is more likely to re-release toxic chemical compounds into your tank. It actually removes and holds more trace elements than anything else- but you need those to stay in the tank in order for your fish to stay healthy and your corals to survive! Worst of all, it can directly cause pH problems."

most of the activated carbon do release toxic as from the article show above. pls correct me if i m wrong with some fact, i m not trying to said you are wrong but, only good quality activated carbon does not release back toxic. the solution is try not to use activated carbon!

sorry if my language is to hard. i m sorry for that

thanks

 

[FroggyFox]

Right...there is a lot of discussion about whether carbon releases toxins back into the tank after a period of time. I haven't read a compelling argument for either side...but I think the general feeling around the board is that we dont use carbon (in Freshwater) on a permanent basis. The only time we use carbon it is specifically to take medications out of the water, or when dealing with some kind of discoloration etc.

You do NOT need to change your FILTER every two months Pigs_Fly...but it would be a good idea to replace the CARBON every couple of months if you really feel the need to use it all the time. If you have the kind of cartridge where you put carbon into the cartridge, then I would seriously reconsider putting the carbon into it to begin with.

 

[wonghee76]

hai....

for the safer way....if the carbon source was not clear....just change the carbon after two week...u can choose not to refill the carbon after that .....carbon was only need for new tank and after some medication or to decoloration....some bad quality carbon can even increase the phosphate level that can cause some algae problem, or effect the pH level or conductivity level..............

who said wana change a filter every two week....this work will kill every tank keeperhahahhaha...then v will have lots of filter at the rubish area ....then the filter may not product enough for consumer.....hahhahahahha......

just good luck for every1 in fish keeping

 

[nobody]

One thing I do with my bettas' tanks is I add a thing called "Betta Bowl Essential." Both Victor and Vibe (my bettas) seem to do really well when I add that. It says it's supposed to neutralize harmful chlorine, chloramine, and ammonia and instantly conditions tap water for fish and plants. I add this whenever I do a water change. I know you said your perameters are fine, but if you don't add something like this already, it might be a good idea. That's all I can suggest, so take the others' advice too. Good luck.