losing fish...concerned about my water quality

N

NEWfishBIGpond

Small Fish
#1
Jun 24, 2009
40
0
0
#1
Let me first say I apologize for the lengthy post & I am new to the hobby...really new so I am learning on the fly and unfortunately my fish are on the "front lines". I got my tank set up and brought home 5 neon and 5 head and tail-lite Tetras. Upon adding the fish to the tank and adding supplements to the water to get the bacteria going, I am now towards the end of the first week w/ the fish. Everything seem to be going well, but the last two days I have lost two of the head and tail-lite tetras. Realizing something is a miss & after reading forums and realizing I don't know what I am doing, I quickly went out and got a test kit.I did the test on my water and got the following readings: Nitrate 10, Nitrite 0, Total hardness (GH) 75, total Alkalinity (KH) ~250 and PH at 8.0. With my tank so new and w/ these being my first fish I am assuming the nitrogen cycle is starting to get where it needs to be because the nitrite is 0 and the nitrate looks like it is starting to creep towards 0 as well. What alarms me is the Alkalinity and the PH. I don't have a bench mark to go off of for my tap water. I will have that tomorrow evening when I do the test on the cup of water I set out overnight, but I read that it is useless to try to get the PH to a certain level and it can even be dangerous, furthermore I am not sure what to do for the alkalinity. I don't want to douse the thing in chemicals, but I don't want to wipe out all my tetras either. Anyhow, any help would be greatly appreciated as I now try to do some damage control and save my poor fish!
FYI, I have a 30 gallon tank w/ a power filter. I took out all the rocks and shells that I had because I read they could be leeching things into my water, so I want to test them prior to re-installing them in the tank.
 

DesignsOnYou

DesignsOnYou

Large Fish
#2
Jun 21, 2008
493
0
0
#2
Hi newfish. Welcome to the tank. I'm tired, so this will just be a quick response. But, the quick version is: it's probably ammonia poisoning. More on that in a minute. Also, don't worry about your pH. Stable is more important than some magic number, and you only need a certain number for breeding some species, etc. I also wouldn't worry about the alkilinity unless you're also dealing with plants. It's great that you've read up some on the nitrogen cycle, which goes: ammonia to nitrite to nitrate. So, your nitrate will never be 0, unless you've maybe JUST done a water change. Also, one of the most important tests is the one that you're missing, and that's ammonia. Some "package" test kits don't include it, and I've never understood why. If you can return what you have, the API Master Test kit for freshwater is a good investement, and will test ammonia, nitrite, nitrate (the big 3) and pH. Or, you can take your water to a store, and they'll usually test it for you. My LFS (local fish store) uses the API kit, which is drops, and seems to be more accurate than the strips my local Petco uses. Wherever you go, get them to write down the actual numbers for you, for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate, and then post them here. Once you figure out what your ammonia is, you basically need to keep it under 1.0 ppm. This usually requires lots of water changes. So, read up on cycling, there's a great link in MissFishy's profile, and get your water tested somewhere. That will be a good start, and is all the energy I have for now. Let us know if you have any other questions.
 

MissFishy

MissFishy

Superstar Fish
#3
Aug 10, 2006
2,237
5
0
Michigan
#3
I am surprised your test kit didn't come with an ammonia test since that is the most important for a new tank that is cycling. Most newbies are overly concerned with their PH, don't worry about it. 8.0 is fine.

It's confusing to get a handle on to begin with, but it sounds like you're on the right track. Take a peek at the link below in my signature for some more information on the cycling process and what you should be looking for. Welcome!
 

N

NEWfishBIGpond

Small Fish
#4
Jun 24, 2009
40
0
0
#4
Thanks for your quick responses....yeah a was concerned when wife came home w/ the kit and it didn't have an ammonia reading. I will do some small water changes until I can get my water tested by the fish store I got them from..this weekend. I will let ya'll know what I find out, hopefully my fish can make it through this period. I will probably feed them every other day until I know what I am dealing with just to help "keep" the toxic levels down. Thanks again and I will read the link posted.
 

Ravenstar

Ravenstar

Medium Fish
#7
Feb 27, 2009
56
0
0
#7
I'm still new as well, but if you've already got nitrates then I agree that it could be ammonia poisoning, but perhaps the fish weren't healthy when you bought them? I recently lost a betta (my first fish, it was heartbreaking :() because the guy I got him from took horrible care of his stock. If the others are doing fine, I wouldn't get terribly upset, but still get the ammonia tested, and get a kit of your own if you can. I've had fabulous results with the API drop kits.
 

N

NEWfishBIGpond

Small Fish
#8
Jun 24, 2009
40
0
0
#8
Thanks everyone for the responses....I am glad there is a community for us newbs. I did a test (w/ the same testing kit) on my tap water and the PH was a little lower but not a big difference. The Nitrate, however was exactly the same. I think it is the old pipes in the town, so the truth is I don't know where I stand in the cycle of my tank. I am going in the morning to get a water tested and hopefully bring home the test kits ya'll suggested. the more I think about it and read ya'lls posts I would say that it is a mixture of the ammonia and maybe even chlorine. I put the water conditioner in before adding the fish but my water is HEAVILY chlorinated, to the point where we cant stand to drink it. So maybe the mixture of this and the ammonia killed the fish that were weaker in health. The others seem to be hanging tough and happy. They don't seem lithargic, or on deaths doorstep. I did a small water change last night and will do another this weekend. I also also started feeding them every other day, so hopefully this will keep the ammonia in check. My wife keeps pushing me to add fish and I am sure the urge will be there when I am at the fish store, but I'm gonna wait until I know my tank is stable....much to the disappointment of my kids and wife.
 

unwritten law

unwritten law

Superstar Fish
#9
Sep 2, 2008
1,471
0
0
36
DC
#9
Just make sure you dechlorinate you water... If you need to add more than is instructed... can't hurt. I have some made by API and it says super strength or something like that... so make sure you get the best kind. In this hobby you really do get what you pay for.
 

MissFishy

MissFishy

Superstar Fish
#10
Aug 10, 2006
2,237
5
0
Michigan
#10
As I think I said before, you don't need to be worrying about your PH levels, they don't matter with the fish you're keeping unless they're swinging all over the place. You need to be worrying about ammonia and nitrites. I know it's really tempting to buy a bunch of fish all at once, but believe me, it takes away from the fun if you get too many at once or they all die.
 

N

NEWfishBIGpond

Small Fish
#11
Jun 24, 2009
40
0
0
#11
unritten law.....I saw in your 46 gallon tank you have shrimp among your fish, they don't try to eat them? Are they large. I was told you can't have shrimp in w/ your fish. I was told that they are like floating treats for your fish.
 

N

NEWfishBIGpond

Small Fish
#16
Jun 24, 2009
40
0
0
#16
Yeah....I cant see them being too exciting to watch...they are crustaceans after all, but I wouldn't mind to have some just to mix things up...If I can manage not to kill my fish off first.

So I went out today got all the equipment I need to "maintain" my tank and and got the API master test kit. My ammonia levels were at .25 ppm, so not as bad as it could have been, but I did do small water changes last night just because I was worried...and didn't know the levels. I went ahead and did another 5 gallons today, so that puts me at about 25% for the week. I will test again tomorrow to see if the level went down at all, but I will say, with in an hour my fish have better colors and seem to have more energy too!!! So it seems like I am winning the battle. What does bum me out is that the instant bacteria chemicals the LFS sold me obviously didn't work OR it isn't built up enough to keep the ammonia down to zero. Could that be the case?? If I had to guess (from what MissFishy said) I am assuming it is the first option. I guess I just have to wait the 4 weeks to get the system balanced before I can start adding fish. It killed me while I was at the LFS today. Looking at all the fish I want and not being able to purchase them.....I was like a handcuffed kid in a candy store!!
 

R

robinanne

Medium Fish
#17
Apr 12, 2009
91
0
0
florida
#17
i am still looking for some ghost shrimp. i agree they would add some variety to the tank. i always thought snails were lame until i got my apple and mystery. they are very interesting and fun to watch. my coworkers are so sick of hearing me talk about them i have to get it out here when ever i have the chance. :)
 

MissFishy

MissFishy

Superstar Fish
#18
Aug 10, 2006
2,237
5
0
Michigan
#18
Most bacteria supplements are worthless and don't do much of anything to help with cycling, no matter what the pet store employees will try to tell you.

I love ghost shrimp, they are in fact very fascinating to watch. I've also kept red cherry shrimp, both are common meals for fish depending on how big the fish are. Red cherries (RCS) are pretty small and expensive snacks for bigger fish.
 

N

NEWfishBIGpond

Small Fish
#19
Jun 24, 2009
40
0
0
#19
So do snails fair a better chance? I plan on completing my tank w/ danios, platies, couple of Cherry Barbs and a couple of dwarf gouramis and maybe a couple of albino cory cats...I'd like to add a shrimp or snail too if they have a chance, but I don't want to add them if they gonna just be "whats for dinner".
 

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