Mandi Vs. Cycling

[missmandi7]

So, here's a long one haha. I set up a 38 gallon cichlid tank about four weeks ago. It was doing great, we added five african cichlids and four yoyo loaches. Then the water turned to milk yayyy. We removed the fish into another tank, and emptied the 38g. I've refilled it and the ammonia will not go away. I was using ammo lock and just read not to use it because it will delay the process, nice to know now so I stopped using that, and have been adding in cycle with the beneficial bacteria. Well my ammonia is still reading at around 8, sometimes less, but barely. the nitrites are at 5 and the nitrates are at 10. The nitrates just showed up about five or six days ago, but the ammonia refuses to budge. I still have no fish in there, but I'm wondering what to do. I just read that someone else has ammonia in their tap water and they have to let their water set for 24 to 48 hours before they put it in, so I tested my tap water, the ammonia is a little less than .5
I'm unsure of what to do now, I would love to put my fish back into their home. I just figured if the nitrites are working, and the nitrates are showing up, that the ammonia would be going down by now. The tank isn't as cloudy as it was, but it's still fairly cloudy. Any help is VERY appreciated, I just want my tank looking gorgeous
Mandi

 

[MissFishy]

My first concern is where you are keeping these fish while your tank is just sitting. They need heat and filtration, especially cichlids. Second, a tank that is just sitting there will not cycle unless you are adding ammonia to it. Since your ammonia readings are constant, that makes me think you have added too many chemicals to your tank (ammo lock, cycle, etc.) and those are messing up your test readings. Cycle will not do anything to help cycle your tank, IMO it's a waste of money.

Here's my suggestion, do a LARGE 80% water change and add water back into your tank (make sure you are treating it BEFORE you are adding it to your tank with a good water conditioner). Make sure the filtration and heaters are on in your tank, and start taking readings. If the bacteria are not being fed ammonia, they will die out (you might want to take a look at the link in my signature about fishless cycling and feeding ammonia). Second, you won't like this one, but you really need to return the fish if you don't have somewhere appropriate that is cycled to keep them while you do this to their main tank. It's not fair to keep them while you work out the issues in the main tank that could take weeks. Further, adding a bunch of fish to the tank all at once again will throw the tank into a mini cycle, and you'll have even more trouble. Cycle the tank, then go back and get the fish.

 

[missmandi7]

Thanks for the advice. I actually have my fish in another aquarium that I am doing multiple water changes on daily. They do have a heater and filter, I do know the minimum requirements of my fish But I'll certainly check out that link! Thanks again.
Mandi.

 

[missmandi7]

So I tried to find someone at work who has a mature fish tank so I can use one of their filter cartridges to filter my tank but the two people I found are having issues right now, ich wise. So that was a big no, so I sat back and thought about what else I could do, and remembered my two betta bowls, I tested their water, just to be sure, and they are both completely cycled, so I took the gravel out of both of their tanks, placed it in three bowls, and put them in different spots in the 38g after I did a 100% water change. This was all last night, and I put two of the fish back in to make some ammonia, I tested this morning and got the ammonia at .5 and the nitrites a little less than .25 Last time I was cycling it took weeks before any nitrites appeared, so I'm hoping we finally found an answer!

 

[missmandi7]

So the tank is in full cycle now I'm so excited, thanks so much for the help MissFishy, your site was very helpful. I've been testing my water in the morning and at night. So far the ammonia has been going down at night, and then I've been adding another fish, then it slightly goes up, then back down to zero. We're up to four cichlids back in the tank, just one more and four yoyos to go! My final question I have though is when do I know when to take the bowls of gravel out? I'd hate to take them out too soon and have to start all over, should I wait until all the fish are back in and it's completely cycled, or would it be okay to do it now?
Thanks again!

 

[jo3olous]

A tank takes a month to cycle usually... over a month if it's fish in.... How could you possibly have cycled your tank in a few days...

 

[jo3olous]

So I tried to find someone at work who has a mature fish tank so I can use one of their filter cartridges to filter my tank but the two people I found are having issues right now, ich wise. So that was a big no, so I sat back and thought about what else I could do, and remembered my two betta bowls, I tested their water, just to be sure, and they are both completely cycled, so I took the gravel out of both of their tanks, placed it in three bowls, and put them in different spots in the 38g after I did a 100% water change. This was all last night, and I put two of the fish back in to make some ammonia, I tested this morning and got the ammonia at .5 and the nitrites a little less than .25 Last time I was cycling it took weeks before any nitrites appeared, so I'm hoping we finally found an answer!

I thought you moved the fish to another tank temp. Why didn't you just take the filter from the tank you moved them too... let me guess that tank isnt cycled either?

 

[missmandi7]

No it was not, that is why I was doing multiple daily water changes to keep them in fresh water. The reason it has cycled so fast was because I had pre-existing betta bowls that I had not thought of that were cycled so I took the gravel out of their bowls for the time being since it had all the bacteria in it that I need, and set it in the 38g to help it out. It's not fully cycled yet, but the ammonia is staying down, and now the nitrites are going down. I just wanted to know when the proper time would be to take out the gravel I have set in bowls.

Also, I find no need for you to be talking to me that way, I'm simply asking for help, I have not had a fish die, and I have not let them be unhappy. I am trying to keep them happy and alive. I have read multiple books, and have talked to multiple people on the subject, but you learn more from the experience of it, and that is exactly what I am doing, if you feel you cannot help me without talking to me in a rude manner, then I will simply ask someone else.

Thanks.

 

[jo3olous]

No it was not, that is why I was doing multiple daily water changes to keep them in fresh water. The reason it has cycled so fast was because I had pre-existing betta bowls that I had not thought of that were cycled so I took the gravel out of their bowls for the time being since it had all the bacteria in it that I need, and set it in the 38g to help it out. It's not fully cycled yet, but the ammonia is staying down, and now the nitrites are going down. I just wanted to know when the proper time would be to take out the gravel I have set in bowls.

Also, I find no need for you to be talking to me that way, I'm simply asking for help, I have not had a fish die, and I have not let them be unhappy. I am trying to keep them happy and alive. I have read multiple books, and have talked to multiple people on the subject, but you learn more from the experience of it, and that is exactly what I am doing, if you feel you cannot help me without talking to me in a rude manner, then I will simply ask someone else.
Thanks.

Sorry worded it wrong don't mean to come off as rude. It was earlier in the morning. *GOLDFISH*
Well with the added info you just gave (gravel from betta bowls etc) it does give me more insight to give you better feedback. Next time you should try to list everything in/everything you have done for the tank so there are no misunderstandings, yes?
gl with the cycle

EDIT*
Wasn't my intention too, but if you intend on asking 'something else', who? You posted a public thread I'm pretty sure everyone who's a member has access to reply just letting you know.

It's actually okay to keep the fish in the tank while the waters cloudy; that's your bacterial bloom taking place. Just do more frequent water changes and the A/N/N numbers will slowly go down. It's not a big deal to put the fish back in the tank if you haven't already

 

[missmandi7]

The water is clear now, and I do have the fish back in the tank, I just want to know when it will be okay to take the bowls of gravel out. It's not completely cycled yet, the ammonia is at zero, and the nitrites are making their way to zero, I wasn't sure if it's okay to take them out now, or if I should wait until the tank is cycled, they're kind of an eye sore

 

[jo3olous]

The water is clear now, and I do have the fish back in the tank, I just want to know when it will be okay to take the bowls of gravel out. It's not completely cycled yet, the ammonia is at zero, and the nitrites are making their way to zero, I wasn't sure if it's okay to take them out now, or if I should wait until the tank is cycled, they're kind of an eye sore

Ahhh so you have the bowls of gravel in the tank, meaning you did not mix the gravel in with yours? Hmmm that is a very interesting situation... I'll have to get back to you

 

[MissFishy]

I've actually suggested people put their "bowls" of cycled gravel or cycled gravel in panty hose in the tank to help cycle before. I would leave the bowls in for at least another week. It takes awhile for the bacteria to colonize on your own gravel. The good results you are seeing now are probably from the already cycled gravel and that bacteria. It may be an eyesore, but leave them in for at least another week and continue monitoring. Patience is a virtue in the fish world.

 

[missmandi7]

Okay, sounds good! Thanks again MissFishy.