Mini Cycle Question

[FishDad]

New 125g with africans is going through a mini cycle. I transfered two filters with long established media to this tank. I thought the new bio load should be less than what they previously had to handle but alas, a mini cycle occured anyway. Slight flashing occurred after about a day and ammonia checked in at .25, nitrite 0. Today is day 5 for the new tank, days 1,2, and 3 I did a 50% change every day to control the ammonia. Now day 5, I havn't done a water change in 2 days and ammonia is the exact same, .25 (nitrites still 0). Flashing is still occuring too.

So my questions is will water changes actually delay the appropriate level of bb from being achieved by starving it of the needed ammonia to increase itself? I thought I might just try to keep it from rising above .25 for the time being. Or is that totally wrong and just keep doing water changes and the bb will grow to the proper level anyway?

Hopefully that question makes sense, its kind of a complicated thing to ask.

 

[KcMopar]

Water change for SURE!!!! The BB grows on your hard surfaces and not much is in the water column. Just be sure to keep pH and temp super close and be sure to rid the water of chlorine and chloramine. The ammonia will be less poisonous if the pH is neutral or less. So if you are adding a pH booster STOP or reduce slowly if you can. You need to water change to keep the ammonia at zero, this burns the fishes gills. Also your test kit might show ammonia if your water treatment suppresses it. You need to see if your treatment makes ammonia inert/removes (laymans terms to make it easy) or not. Either way do water changes until you are sure.

 

[FishDad]

Currently using top fin dechlor which does not treat ammonia. Temp is 82. Ph is 7.8, I never have tried to raise it as they have never seemed to mind. I did another water change last night and ammonia is still at .25. Still seeing minimal flashing. Today I purchased an ammonia alert and a bottle of prime by seachem per recos on this forum. Havn't used the prime yet but the alert is showing no ammonia even though liquid test shows .25. Strange. Kc do you think I should use the prime to alleviate the ammonia effects or would that effect the cycle?

 

[KcMopar]

I would hit it with the prime!!! Orangecones talks very highly of this and her advice is spot on. Note, it will show ammonia on your tests, but I am not sure about the alert thingy. Seems like someone said it does not show bound ammonia. Maybe OC will jump in, either way use the prime.

 

[FishDad]

I will then. And yes the ammonia alert claimes to only register ammonia in the toxic form unlike the liquid test. However currently it shows nothing, but because of the flashing and the .25 liquid reading I'm not sure I trust that.

 

[CAPSLOCK]

The liquid test is more precise than the alert badge I'm sure, so it may just be at a low enough level not to show on the badge. I have also read that the badge doesn't show bound ammonia.

 

[FishDad]

I figured the same thing. I really only bought the badge to distinguish between toxic and non toxic ammonia since the liquid cannot.

 

[lauraf]

Yup, the disk only shows toxic ammonia...good call on the Prime. I use it to help with mini-cycles for sure.

 

[OrangeCones]

The liquid test is more precise than the alert badge I'm sure, so it may just be at a low enough level not to show on the badge. I have also read that the badge doesn't show bound ammonia.

I disagree that the liquid test kits for ammonia are more precise that the Ammonia Alert Disk in detection levels of Free Ammoia. Most liquid test kits do not show any color change until 0.25ppm are registerered, and the color change is very very subtle. See this color chart:

Downloads; Pump and filter Instructions, Test Kit charts

The Ammonia Alert Disk changes color at 0.02ppm for Free Ammonia (NH3).

The Ammonia Alert Disk will not indicate anything for Ammonium (NH4), only free Ammonia (NH3). If you dechloriniator 'binds' ammonia (such as Prime), it will still show on the liquid test kits. However, it will NOT show on the Ammonia Alert Disk. Free Ammonia is what is toxic to fish. I've used the Ammonia Alert Disks for many years, and have helped schools/daycare centers set up 'class aquariums' using this. It has reduced the 'in cycle' fish death rate to zero, which is a) great for the fish and also b) great for the kids not to see dead fish floating around.

The flashing of fish that have been affected by ammonia poisoning can continue for days/weeks after the ammonia is cleared. With the exception of some danio species, fish cannot repair gills damanged by ammonia poisoning. With reduced ability to intake oxygen due to the gill damange, they will continue to 'flash' somewhat in their efforts to rid themselves of what is 'chocking' their ability to take in oxygen. Flashing can also indicate a parasite infestation. This is not caused directly by the high ammonia levels, but when the fish is weaker, parasites can take over more easily.

Increasing oxygen concentrations should help.

 

[FishDad]

Thanks OC, good info. So far my alert disk hasn't changed from the .02ppm color. In your experience have you ever had a brand new disk fail?

 

[OrangeCones]

In your experience have you ever had a brand new disk fail?

Hasn't happend to me yet. You can test it by opening a bottle (AWAY FROM FISH TANK!!!) of cleaner that is or contains ammonia, and hold the disk over the top of the open bottle. It should react quickly to the 'fumes' of the ammonia. I do this on a every-other-month basis just to make sure things are ok.

 

[FishDad]

Awsome I will try that.

 

[FishDad]

It worked, thanks again OC.

 

[OrangeCones]

You're welcome, FishDad. Keep in mind, the disks react quickly to a rise in ammonia, but more slowly to a fall in ammonia. After 'alerting' almost instantly to the cleaner, it will take a few hours to register a lower level.

Good lucik with your fish and keeping them healthy!

 

[KcMopar]

Thanks OC!! Thats great info you have!!