new member and a big project

[footastic02]

Hello all.
I got into freshwater fish about 12 years ago and always had a few tanks even when I was moving every year in college. Great fun! My favorite setup (first pic) was my Allglass 75E filtered by a Magnum 350 and two undergravel powerheads. I built a custom stand for it with a little 10G in the corner. I had a Clown knife in there that grew to over 26in before I broke it all down and stored it away during a divorce.*thumbsdow
I have been without an aquarium for about four years now. I believe I am now over compensating for the lost time.
I just got a Perfecto- Marineland 220G!
I have a few questions and I am open to any observations or ideas.

I understand that a fully loaded 220G will weigh upwards of 2,200lbs.
I have attached a pic of the stand I started to build yesterday for it, the old 75G is sitting on the bottom shelf.
Each leg is made from (2) 2"x10" pressure treated boards
The spans are a 2"x10" also that I have attached with 3" carriage bolts and 2 1/2" wood screws and 16p galvanized nails. I will deck the top and bottom shelf of the stand in 3/4" plywood. It measures 74" long by 26" front to back and sits 48" high. All that weight will be rather high so I am going to screw the stand to the studs in the wall of my living room.
The 75G has been stored in a storage shed and will be used to house a 4' Ball Python. (I dont trust it for water tightness anymore)
The whole stand will be finished and trimmed just like the old white stand.

Q: Does anyone have experience with stands for tanks like this? I feel pretty confident this stand will hold the weight. Is there any reason that I should rethink this?

I am planning on using my old Magnum 350 canister filter. It is rated for a 100G tank. I am going to buy a second canister filter that is rated for a 150G tank. I will set each canister on the lower shelf on either side.
Q: Does anyone see a problem with this plan? Does anyone have a recommendation for which pump to buy?

I also want to put a few power heads in there for an undergravel filter. I am planning on making my own undergravel filter using glass marbles that cover the entire bottom of the tank. Then covering them with a sheet of plexiglass that is cut to fit and drilled with a few hundred small holes. I'll cover it all with a few inches of gravel and run my tubes up to the Power heads.
Q: Will this be an effective alternative to a store bought (if I can find one) unit? Is there any reason this wont work?

Im having a blast and I am looking forward to sharing my thoughts and experiences.
Thanks for any input or insight!

 

[Orion]

Forget the under gravel filter. No real need for it, plus a lot more headache than its worth. If I had went this far if it were me I would just get a few newer canister filers, or use that 75 as a sump.

Eh, I wouldnt want that much weight bolted to my walls. IF anything made that thing tip, I'd be afraid it might pull the studs loose.

Dont forget to brace the floor if yours needs it!

Looking forward to pics as your project continues!

 

[skjl47]

Hello; Been looking at the unpainted wooden stand.
Looks as if the legs are bolted to the frame with two bolts at each corner. Did you use any type of adhesive in addition to the bolts?

If I understand the stand, it appears that the load will be carried by the bolts at each corner. I would likely sister some more dimensional lumber to each corner to directly carry the load of the horozontal boards to the floor. I hope my comment makes sense.

Do you plan to be able to take the stand apart in the future? If not, some construction adhesive or wood glue where the boards meet will add some strength.

 

[skjl47]

Hello; Are the 2 1/2 inch screws you used rated for use with pressure treated wood? It is my understanding that the chemicals in that type wood will corrode some types of screws. I am sorry that I do not recall which type screw to use, but know there is a suggested type.

 

[skjl47]

Hello; On the filtration. I have underfiltered, by todays standards at any rate, many tanks over the years with good results. I tend to go by the amount of fish in a tank and not so much by the gallons. You can use the filter you have for a time and add more if needed when the budget allows. An air pump with bubblers and /or a few sponge filters are often additions to my tanks.

I ran a 125 gallon for a number of years with a 20 gallon undergravel filter in one corner, a sponge filter buried in the gravel and one early model HOB type filter. I also had some bubblers. It was fine.

 

[skjl47]

Hello; Been reading threads on a forum, Monster fish keepers, there is lots of stuff on that site about big tanks. Here is the address

http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/

 

[footastic02]

Thanks for the input to you both.
I agree with you skjl47, on the undergravel filter- sorry Orion. I have also had great success with the undergravel setup. More over this time around I am leaning toward the undergravel setup less for the filtering and a little more for creating a bit of a "current". I am kicking around the idea of making this tank a single specimen tank. Possibly a Payara. I guess I am sort of reverting back to what I know.
I've read a fair amount about the drawback/dangers of this approach but I have never had any of the listed problems in the past. If it is just a matter of saving money then I'm not worried about it. I vacuum my gravel on a regular basis, I enjoy messing with my aquarium. So the waste build up shouldn't be an issue.

As far as the structure of the stand...
I used two 2x10's at each corner, one is 48" tall and has the carriage bolts through it to attach the horizontals to the legs. It is flush with the top of the horizontals and will help support the 3/4" plywood surface. The second 2x10 of each leg is 9 and 1/4" shorter and buts up directly under the horizontal 2x10 and is flush with the front surface. (Lumber mills cut what they call 2x10's at an actual measurement of ABOUT 1 1/2" x 9 1/4"). The two vertical 2x10's are "married" together with liquid nails, the 2 1/2" wood screws and 16p nails. I do believe the screws to be rated for pressure treated wood.
I am going to listen to Orion and NOT attach the stand to the studs in the wall. I think it would take a tornado or earthquake to tip this setup over anyway.

My big question now is about heating.
This tank will sit against an external wall. In the winter the room gets a bit cold: 65-67 degrees isn't uncommon. My concern is two fold: One thing is that I am planning on putting my snake in the lower tank to save space. He needs day and night heat lamps that will be on timers, 85-95 degrees will be the norm. That heat will obviously rise under the aquarium and gravel bed. Will this be a problem (bacteria-etc) or just help heat my water? I wanted to install only one inline heater on one of my canister filters. I will start with one rated for a 150 gal. If the supplementary heat from the reptile heater doesn't help enough then I can always get another one. -right??
I'll also head over to Monsterfishkeepers.com to see what they have in mind

 

[paperdog9]

I would say just insulate the back of the tank to help keep the cold from going in through the outside wall. You could probably just use a nice sized layer of styrofoam if you needed to.

There shouldn't be any problems with heating the bottom of the tank, that might even be a for the better. I know that my tanks can sometimes be at the right temperature that I have my heater set for, but under the gravel it stays about 5 degrees cooler, so heating from the bottom will help to more evenly spread heat throughout the tank.

You should definately use the in line heater along with the heat lamps underneath, but I have no experience with canister filters so I don't know if you can put 2 heaters on.

I hope I help and good luck! I'm excited this project sounds really cool!

 

[Orion]

Don't apologize to me for anything, it's your tank. There's a lot better options than UGF's available and if I were setting up a tank this size I would go with something easier to maintain and more efficient filtration wise. Anymore there really isn't even a need for them. If your just wanting extra water circulation you can always go back and add just a power head later if the regular filtration isn't enough.

I don't know what to tell you about the heat lamps. Never kept large herps, so not sure how many lights or how hot they get, but the smaller ones I've kept some of the lights have given off quite a bit of heat. My concern would be the type of the glass the tanks made out of. I'm a paranoid person anyway when it comes to this stuff, and I would be afraid that the temp changes might stress the glass. I really don't know. I have kept a couple of 80w incandescent for a herp tank under a 29 gallon before, and the change in temp in the water was negligible. So if you did have enough heat coming up to actually heat the water in the tank, I might really be worried about the effect on the glass bottom. This I think would really be something you might want to try and check with maybe the manufacturer, or perhaps other people who have done something similar with such a large tank. A few hundred gallons of water on the floor is a messy mistake.

 

[paperdog9]

Maybe to be safe from direct contact with the heat from the lamps, you could insulate the bottom with styro or something as well. I don't know if styrofoam will melt in that heat, but you you could probably use just about any insulating foam. Never really thought about the glass Orion, but I agree I would be worried about it as well. Hope I helped!

 

[ValRasbora]

My dad's made my a couple stands, though they've all been for tanks >20 but they still seem like they could hold waay more than that!
Really looking forward to seeing your stocking and how it turns out. You sooooo have to plant it!!

 

[footastic02]

Update:
So I am just about done with the stand. Its amazing how busy I've been and finding time to work on it has been a challenge. I've been taking it slow and steady. I am ready to move the stand into the house now. I have trimmed it out to about 90% I have not attached the doors yet because then there would be nowhere to lift it from. I dont want to put any more finishing touches on it until it is already moved and not subject to damage.
The stand is so large that I need help getting it out of the garage and in the door.
I am planning on setting up the snake first and getting him settled because he has been in a temporary 55 gal sitting by a window for some time now.
Then... I am going to add about 50 gal to the 220 tank and let it sit with no gravel etc. I will observe the affect the snake lamps have on the tanks' underside and water temp, if any, before moving ahead. Im getting excited about it and will post pics as soon as the move is underway.

 

[footastic02]

almost done



So Im about done trimming the stand. In this pic I dont have the white shelf installed on the bottom where the 75 gal is going. I was cleaning sawdust out of the shelf rollers. There is enough room inside the doors on either side for the canister filters to fit. I have installed a panel on a piano hinge along the bottom in the front so that I can store my gravel vacuum etc under the stand. I am also putting trim on the bottom sides- but after I move it into the living room.
Once I get help to put the 220 tank on the top, I will trim the top edge so that it covers the 8p nails on the stand and the bottom oak frame of the tank. In the next few weeks I will build a canopy topper to cover the top of the stand, create some reinforcement for the lid against jumping fish and house my custom lighting plan. Now I'm shopping for a good inline heater.
Slowly but surely.....coming along!
My wife wants me to finish with this project ASAP so we can start on the nursery for our first born.*SUPERSMIL

 

[Lionel]

Looks good. Congrats on the impending child.

 

[nanu156]

I use UG filters in addition to Aquaclear 110's on all my tanks. I put AQ 50-70 heads (whatever I find for a good deal) on the corner posts on each side, I like one low to the bottom and one up high. With the head sucking the water through the gravel then blowing it back out into the tank I don't have problems with stagnant waste. I wouldn't trust an UG with just bubble lines running down to it tho... Doesn't really seem like something that would work given the laws of physics and biology.

I think your stand looks pretty sturdy. Check ebay and amazon for heads and filters if you need them, you can usually pick em up for cheap there.

 

[Thyra]

I inherited a 30g tank when my daughter and husband moved into a house that had no reasonable place for the tank. For a couple of months they hounded me about taking the tank, but I was afraid. This was over a year ago and I had just gotten involved on the forum and was learning all these things about keeping fish I had never been exposed to before. The problems I could foresee included: The tank was almost 9 years old and never had a water change. It was city water (Tacoma) and they had never heard of using dechlorinator or any chemicals. I have a well. It had an underground filter. It had two large angel fish that had lived in that environment for at least 5 years or more and obviously thrived fine in spite of what appeared to be neglected care.

In the end it became almost an emergency. Son-in-law emptied the tank, put fish in bucket with some water and arrived here an hour later. Fortunately I knew the measurements of the tank and had a level secure place for it, but that was it. I checked the temp of the water they were in and we proceeded to refill the tank with well water - and probably the 2 or 3 gallons of water they arrived in. I left the UGF out because I didn’t understand how it worked with what equipment it came with, but the whole point of this I wanted to make was everyone I had mentioned that filter to said what a mess it would be after all those years. Well, it wasn’t. Son-in-law said there was very little debris under there and it wasn’t a smelly mess either so I figure they must work fine with very little, if any, attention and I am sorry now I didn’t put it back.

The fish continue to do fine plus I have added a couple of small shoals of tetras.