New tank setup- Need advice

[keithk831]

Hey everyone, so I think i'm going to upgrade to a bigger tank. I'm thinking a 20gal will be the best bet for us (plus it'll fit in the TV space in our entertainment center we dont use). We currently have a 5 gallon hex, but my wife isn't happy because it doesnt have any fish she likes.

Petsmart has a Top Fin 20 gallon tank w/ hood and light for 54.99. They also have a whole kit (with filter, heater, a net, and samples) for 89.99. I'm thinking if I just get the tank and hood and buy a filter, I can spend around $71.

Here are a few questions I have:

1. Do I need a heater? Our 5 gallon stays at a pretty consistent range of 78-80 without a heater.

2. I have heard about "grates" you can put underneath the gravel to allow waste to collect under it rather than in the gravel, making it easier to keep clean. Should I do that, or just have the gravel on the floor?

3. If I don't go with the kit and can choose my own filter, should I get one that's "up to" 20 gallons, or one that filters "up to" 30 gallons? Does Top Fin make a good pump/filter? Price for a 30 is 15.99.

4. Assuming we don't get any fish that get bigger than 2" each, how many fish could we have in that tank? I would move my cories into the new tank and probably want a couple more, plus any fish my wife wants. She'll probably want goldfish or tetras.

I'm just trying to figure out the cheapest way to get a setup like that going, and I want to make it somewhat of a surprise. Thanks!

 

[jediinthedark]

1) heaters are always a good idea. The temperature in a room can fluctuate a lot, but ultimately it's up to you. Since you're in Provo you may not have many cold nights (I don't know though). Night is when my heaters kick on the most.

2) I think what you're talking about are Undergravel Filters. I'm not a fan. Most people on this board aren't either, but it is a perfectly valid way to filter a tank. The problems are that an undergravel filter is actually harder to clean - when you have to then a standard filter, and it's less effective.

3) I would choose to go "Up to 30." It's always better to over-filter then under.
I'm a fan of Aquaclear filters. Very easy to use, seem reliable, and the filter media is reusuable - thus saving you money each month.

4) Tetras. No goldfish. You'll be able to put a max of two goldfish in a 20 gallon tank.
As far as what tetras... Buy them in largeish schools. Maybe 8 or 9. I'm thinking Cardinals, Flame Tetras, Rummy Nose, etc. Tetras that size you can stock about two schools of 9(ish) in your 20 gallon plus your bottom feeders. If you want larger tetras - like Skirt tetras then your schools will need to be smaller. Maybe 6 fish per school.

Please make sure that you cycle the tank before adding fish - especially a full load like I mention above. If you need advice on cycling just ask and we'll point you in the right direction.

One more thing... make sure that the TV cabinet is going to hold an aquarium. Aquariums are heavier then TVs of comparable size. at 8.5 lbs per gallon a 20 gallon tank will weigh 170 lbs (before gravel).
Also ask yourself if the TV stand is made of a material that will crumble when it gets wet? Particle board, chip board, etc.

Good luck!

Jonathan

 

[keithk831]

Great info...thanks. Also, what about an air stone? Would I need one of those, or should a power filter aerate the water enough?

 

[keithk831]

Also, since I have bottom feeders should I get an algae eater? Would you guys say that $90 for a 20-gallon kit is a good deal? That includes tank, hood, filter, heater, and samples.

 

[CAPSLOCK]

Hold off on an algae eater until you have algae, and then go for something that will stay small (an oto or a mystery/apple snail is a good choice, a chinese algae eater or a pleco is not).

An air stone is up to you - it doesn't hurt anything, but it does make the water evaporate more quickly. It's not necessary if you've got a decent filter on there. It depends if you want the extra pump running and if you like the look of the bubbles coming up.

I also wanted to second that the undergravel grates more of a pain to clean - with the power filter, all you do is unplug it and change out the cartridge. To clean the grate you have to remove all the gravel (which will probably stir the gunk up anyways) to pull the grate out and clean it. You can get a gravel vacuum to suction out water and gunk directly from the gravel while you're cleaning, and then you don't have to worry about the gunk collecting. Plus with cories moving around the bottom they tend to stir up the gunk so it gets sucked into the filter rather than collecting in the gravel.

 

[jediinthedark]

The air stone may or may not be needed. We don't have AC in our house, and I use a canister filter. That means my water doesn't have much surface agitation, so not a lot of O2 goes into the water. This setup is good for plants and most of the time the plants provide all of the O2 that the tank needs. When it gets hot though, I need to run the air stone to introduce fresh O2 or else the fish really suffer and die.
If you have a "hang on the back" (HOB) filter then you'll probably be ok with out an airstone. The HOB filter will probably stir up the water enough to introduce O2 for the fish.

Airstones usually don't hurt anything though. More often then not I think they're cosmetic. Some fish really like playing in the bubbles though, so that's a plus.

I agree that you want to wait until you get some algae to support an algae eater. A common Pleco is not appropriate for your tank. They will grow to be over a foot long. Instead look into Ottos (which I'm a big fan of) and small Plecos - Rubber Nose Pleco, and some others all stay under 6".

Jonathan

 

[keithk831]

Sounds good. Now, I wanted to run these two options past you guys for your input:

1. Top Fin 20-gallon Kit
-Includes Power Filter (probably a 20-gallon one)
-100 watt adjustable heater
-Tank and hood
-Thermometer strip, net, and samples
-Total cost- $89.99

2. Top Fin 20-gallon tank with hood- $54.99
-Top Fin 30 gallon filter- $24.99
-100 watt adjustable heater- $19.99
-Already own a net, food and chemicals
-Total is $99.97, plus a couple bucks for a thermometer strip

Would it be worth it to get a bigger filter, or would I be ok with the one that comes in the kit? Are these prices good? Anything I can do to get the price a little lower without compromising much?

 

[Cichlid-Man]

Being OCD about my tanks, i really don't like heaters. I check on the tanks so much, and fiddle with them that i am always monitoring my water.

Regardless, i always have a heater on hand just incase and think everyone should (especially since they are fairly inexpensive), but i don't usually actively use one, i don't see the need with my setup. If i do its usually at a very low setting.

Ditch the temp strip, go with a digital. A decent coralife one will run you like $7. Its more accurate.

Prices vary place to place, so its hard to give you an accurate yes or no on specific pricing. However i personally might be inclinded to shop around. Any other stores near you? You might be able to find the tank/hood cheaper by itself. The filter, thats a pretty good average amount i'd guess for a HOB of that size ($25-30). Though i personally would look into a different brand, maybe i'm biased?

 

[Whiskers]

IMO i would buy the tank and hood but not the whole kit. if you buy the filter system seperate you can get a better one than what comes in the kit. i think the ones in the kits are barely good enough for the tank they come with and i want the third the not using of a undergravel filter.

like cichlid-man said don't buy a temp strip (their junk IMO)in stead get a thermometer and if you need to save a couple bucks i found that there is a white plastic one that has a green area for the ok range and is easy to read for a few bucks and i've had good luck with them.

i've been told that a heater is only for keeping the tank from too dramatic of a water temp change but i would have one anyway.

as far as a bubble stone they are a pain IMO and so i use a bubble wand and yes a couple of my fish like to play in it.

And i think the rule for fish goes (someone correct me if i'm wrong) 1" of fish per gallon. so your 20 gal tank can handle 20" of fish therefore 10 - 2" fish 5 - 4" fish and so on.

Even though i really like your idea of using the unused entertainment center for a fish stand i've got to agree with jediinthedark that chip board wouldn't support a tank for a very long time. I've seen too many of them warp just from the weight from a tv.

Good luck keithk831 hope you can get everything in your price range.

 

[keithk831]

Bought an Aqueon 26 gallon bowfront tank kit today! Going to find a stand and gravel tomorrow and i'll get it cycling! It has a 30-gallon filter and heater.