One clown dead, another not looking good.

[kotranza]

Hello, I've looked through the links for diagnosing problems but I'm having a really hard time trying to classify whats wrong.

We have two reef tanks, a 40g and a 20 tall. The 40 has been up for almost a year, the 20 for a few weeks. The 20 was started with water and live rock from the 40, and cultured sand from a local fish store.

The 40 gallon contains two Percs, a blue hippo tang, a Bird wras, a Domino, a jewel damsel 2-3 sand sifter snails, and several hermit crabs. Also has several large chunks of live rock with purple algae, and several ornamental pieces with significant green algae growth.

The 20 gallon contains a Yellow Tang, an arrow crab, a black and white striped damsel, a serpent star, a couple of hermit crabs and a Ruby Shrimp. Until 10 minutes ago it also had an immature perc. Also contains a chunk of live rock, cultured sand and small amounts of green algae.

Here are the problems:

40 Gallon: The female Perc has it's mouth gaping wide open, and a long, very thin whitish string coming from it's anus. Small spiky things are protruding from the gill slits. Our lighting was down for repairs for a few days. During that time the female perc mostly laid on the bottom in a piece of PVC tubing. I reinstalled the lights last night, and she is now swimming around near the surface with the male, occasionally sticking her face out of the water, but but her mouth is still hanging open and she has not eaten. The male perc looks normal, but he is staying very close to the female.

SG: 1.024
Ammonia: appears to be safe based on teststrip results
Temp 81deg F
I don't have a test kit for PH or Nitrates/Nitrites
The tank actually looks pretty good, except for the Clown.

20 Gallon: This one worries me more. The immature perc just up and died a little while ago. It looked ok yesterday, swimming around in the top half of the tall tank. We returned home tonight to find on the bottom just kind of wiggling about. A little while later it died. At the same time we found a recently deceased hermit crab. The other inhabitants seem to be ok. In addition, there are several black spots under the sand against the glass, they formed about a week after we set up the tank.

SG: 1.022
Ammonia appears to be safe
Temp 72def F

At this point my main concern is the female Perc. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[HMarcks]

Just because I know the experts are going to ask when they get around to it... By Amonia appears to be safe what do you mean, is it at 0? You should get the other test kits.
Also I am not sure about this but isn't 72F a little cold for a reef?

 

[Lotus]

I'm going to move this to the saltwater section, with a redirect.

It sounds to me like you've got a lot of fish in your 20g in a very short time. The temperature is also low in that tank.

 

[zoalover34]

First question would be why do you have a tang in a 20 gallon tank! How big is this 'chunk' of rock you have in there pound wise? Temp is pretty low as lotus pointed out, you want it about 78-80.. without the other test kits its hard to say what it could be, but do everyone a favor and get both tangs out of those tanks! Im sure you going to say im planing on upgrading and its only temparory but everyone says that and hardly anyone does, the fish are going to outgrow those tanks very fast and will be stressed! You should really research on what size of a tank a fish needs before sticking it in whatever you want! sorry for the rant!

 

[Lorna]

Well by the time I write this I am sure the clowns will have passed on and you will still have major issues to contend with, the main one being the stocking of these tanks...

(The 40 gallon contains two Percs, a blue hippo tang, a Bird wras, a Domino, a jewel damsel 2-3 sand sifter snails, and several hermit crabs. Also has several large chunks of live rock with purple algae, and several ornamental pieces with significant green algae growth. )

The hippo tang and bird wrasse are both totally inappropriate for a 40g tank both need a tank of at least a 120 with a 6foot length to provide adequate swimming room both of these fish get large and need space. The domino and jewel damsels together with the percs are probably creating enough stress to cause any number of issues. Clowns are members of the damsel family......all can be on the aggressive side, coupled with the tang and the wrasse you have a recipe for a bunch of very stressed fish in a small space. I am suprised that they lasted a year before someone succumbed to some disease....which was probably carried over to the new tank especially as it was jump started from this one.....The sand sifting stars are doomed to die and may well be already dead if you haven't seen them lately. They need a huge footprint of an very well established sand bed to survive and even then most don't survive long and eventually starve to death

(The 20 gallon contains a Yellow Tang, an arrow crab, a black and white striped damsel, a serpent star, a couple of hermit crabs and a Ruby Shrimp. Until 10 minutes ago it also had an immature perc. Also contains a chunk of live rock, cultured sand and small amounts of green algae.)

Again, a yellow tang in a 20g????? what are you thinking? this is again a fish that needs linear space to swim and can't be a happy camper at all, especially housed with two other aggressive fish namely the damsel and clown who would probably be at each other but there is obviously other issues more demanding at present. I don't really suspect ammonia, but you have created a large bioload that a small chunk of live rock probably can't handle, without proper testing I wouldn't hazard a guess but could be. You need to rethink your stocking, take the tangs to the lfs and stock with either all damsels or research smaller community fish

 

[jumpfreak26]

kotranza-Welcome to MFT! just a note. dont be intimidated by these comments, they are here to help. These guys know there stuff, and there not here to bash on you. They want to help, so instead of getting frustrated(i would be if i read this and i had your tank) just stick with us and well help you out. I just want to make sure you stay here and make your tank healthy and thriving, instead of leaving in rage and keeping going the way you have been going. Remember, there is no right way to build a reef, but there are countless wrong ways. Just lettin ya know.

Anyways, again 1st things to do would be to give your tangs away to a better home, your keeping ferrari in on a go cart track. It needs a place to be comfortable. And get some good test kits. Aquarium Pharmaceuticals has some awesome kits, and they have a full out SW test kit at pet stores for like 50 dollars i think. great invesment, should last you over a year.

Also, if you want you rperc to live, the best thing for it right now is daily to every other day water changes until you can figure out what the problem is.

 

[Lorna]

Good advice JumpFreak, I was a tad harsh but if I had a dollar for every lfs who sells someone a tang for a small tank I could just kick a few. The first thing you should do is water changes to try and gain some control. Isolate the sick fish and then get a couple of good books and do some research on the hobby. A good start is "The New Marine Aquarium" by Michael Paletta and another is "The Concientious Marine Aquariust" by Robert Fenner both are very good resources for those starting out.......or trying to gain a handle on a rewarding but can be very frustrating hobby....also, take a read of the stickies at the top of this forum they contain some really good advice from those who have been there and done it......