Over the side & canister vs undergravel

#1
Hello!

I've almost always used an undergravel filter for every tank I've had since I was 5. I like them and find it nicer not to have to worry about changing carbon/zeolite etc. etc.

Recently I became a recipient of both an over the tank and a canister filter. They both seem to work fine (I used them to cycle the 55 gallon that I'm moving my tiger oscar into), but I was wondering what the opinions of others were?
 

bassbonediva

Superstar Fish
Oct 15, 2009
2,010
0
0
Northern Arizona
#2
I have heard bad things about UG (undergravel) filters. Waste can get trapped under there and they are basically massive nitrate factories.

The only time you have to change any media in a hang-on-back (HOB) or canister filter is when it is starting to fall apart. Carbon and other additives aren't strictly necessary. What IS necessary is a lot of surface area for your beneficial bacteria to colonize on. Canister filters and HOB filters are great for this because you can stuff them full of media (sponges, blue filter pad, etc). From what I understand, the only place for the beneficial bacteria to colonize when using an UG filter is on the gravel, which is really not that much surface area (when compared with tanks that run HOB and canister filters). More beneficial bacteria=stronger cycle. Also, if you want to use sand in your tanks (I have sand in almost every one of my tanks as it is easier to maintain than gravel), you absolutely cannot use an UG filter anyway.
 

Helena21

Superstar Fish
Oct 7, 2005
1,850
2
0
32
Essex, England
#3
Yeah, ive also heard the undergravel filters arent that great....they may be cheap but i wouldnt bother with one myself. They can cause problems.

HOB and canister filters are much better and less likely to cause problems in the future. Im sure they are way more healthier for the tank and fish, too.
 

ryanoh

Large Fish
Mar 22, 2010
858
0
0
#4
My LFS uses undergravel filters for all their tanks, and they have a canister on each of their salt water tanks as well. My guess is they mainly do it because its cheaper that way since they seem to have one massive airpump somewhere in the store with a million hoses running out to their 25 or so tanks.
For a home tank though we've never had anything other than a HOB for a freshwater, and a canister for saltwater.
I don't have any experience with internal filters, but I guess it makes sense to have one if you're doing a heavy planted tank because then you don't have the waterfall effect from the HOB breaking the surface and letting the CO2 out of the water.
 

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brian1973

Superstar Fish
Jan 20, 2008
2,001
3
38
Corpus Christi, Texas
#5
I don't have any experience with internal filters, but I guess it makes sense to have one if you're doing a heavy planted tank because then you don't have the waterfall effect from the HOB breaking the surface and letting the CO2 out of the water.
You dont want an undergravel filter in a planted tank, the roots will grow thru the plates making it almost impossible to safely remove the plants without damaging them.

I used undergravel back in the early 80's with no known problems, but when I tore the tanks down it was a mess underneath the plates so now I would never use one.

beneficial bacteria lives on every surface of your tank regardless of type of filtration, regardless of the surface area you provide in a filter the bacteria load is only going to be as large as it needs to for the tank, if there isnt enough food for the bacteria it isnt going to survive. So the real question is how much surface area does the bacteria need to survive? If your water parameters are within the safe ranges then I would say you have sufficient surface area.

The HOB and canister are going to provide chemical (carbon bags), mechanical (filter floss) and biological (bacteria living on sponges, bio wheels, etc) where the only filtration the undergravel is going to provide is biological, some may argua that it provides mechanical because the gravel would act as floss or pads in the other 2 filters but due to the size of gravel alot of large waste will get thru it and settle on the bottom of the tank, where canisters and HOB's catch the waste on removable filter pads that can be changed or cleaned.

If you are using an HOB filter with a disposable cartridge bag that is prefilled will carbon do not wait for it to fall apart before changing it, if it falls apart it will dump the contents of the carbon bag into the tank and will suck some of it back into the filter and possibly damage the impeller. I know this from experience.
 

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ryanoh

Large Fish
Mar 22, 2010
858
0
0
#6
You dont want an undergravel filter in a planted tank, the roots will grow thru the plates making it almost impossible to safely remove the plants without damaging them.
I meant one of these:

I see people using them in their planted tanks on Youtube, but I've never had one so I don't really have that much to say about it.
 

lstorns

Medium Fish
Aug 8, 2010
86
0
0
#7
I have an under gravel , but I ve hooked my aquaclear to It. I also keep plants and they are doing great, I just stacked some bigger rocks and filled behind them with eco complete so I have depth for roots. and as far as the cleaning goes , I pop the lid on th last UGF access hole and the filter sucks it clean. ( I put a pitcher under the water return so I can dump it). There not for everyone though. the reason I started doing it is because in over 20 yrs of fish keeping I ve had everything from sea anemones to frogs to fish fry get sucked in to my hang on filter intakes and just got sick of it.
 

Feb 27, 2009
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36
#9
There not for everyone though. the reason I started doing it is because in over 20 yrs of fish keeping I ve had everything from sea anemones to frogs to fish fry get sucked in to my hang on filter intakes and just got sick of it.
Exactly this reason is why I use sponge filters powered by airstones or submersible powerheads now. *twirlysmi
 

aakaakaak

Superstar Fish
Sep 9, 2010
1,324
0
0
Chesapeake, Virginia
#10
I took some foam and stuck it on the end of my HOB intake for both tanks. If I ever get fry they won't end up eaten. It's also starting to become a convenient eating spot as it prevents floating food from getting sucked into the filter.
 

Oct 3, 2010
308
0
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Detriot Mi
#11
I just recently switched to an planted aquarium and after having an under gravelfilter for 2 years and not cleaning out i no i should have cleaned it out but i did clean out my aquarium every month
I have heard bad things about UG (undergravel) filters. Waste can get trapped under there and they are basically massive nitrate factories.
YES YES when i cleaned out it after i switched it was poo city so i think
that the best choice should be a canister my grandma has 1 and her tank is spotless