Cichlid brawl in my tank, a new alpha male has emerged.

[Swordtail8]

I have a 29 gallon mbuna tank. This morning, I turned the light on walked away for a while and then came back about twenty minutes later. The blue cichid with red fins versus the purple and brown striped cichlid were having a battle (including putting their mouths together).

The purple and brown cichlid is one mean fish. He has murdered many new fish I introduced and ripped the tail off of my electric yellow (but the tail grew back somewhat and the electic yellow and him seem to not conflict anymore). This guy is the alpha male. He claimed so much territory and makes alot of fish hide in the corner. But as time went on, the blue cichlid with red fins grew larger but still let the smaller alpha male pick on him.

But this morning, they had a brawl for the position of alpha male. What was funny is that all the other fish were hanging around watching the fight in the center of the tank and not hiding like they usually do. But in the end of the battle my blue cichlid got a few good bites on the purple/brown cichlid. Now the purple brown cichlid clearly has bruises on him while the blue cichlid with red fins seems fine. Plus, the winner has erect fins, the loser for the first time is not holding erect fins.

I think this is a good thing overall though because the new alpha male isnt as aggresive and keeps the more aggressive fish in check.

 

[cakelady204]

Wow! I really enjoyed reading that. So the tank has a new leader. Sounds like he might have better managerial skills! It is funny how the other fish were like the audience for the fight! Could you tell if they were cheering on the winner?!LOL!

 

[Toam]

Definitely made good reading. Also very glad to hear your tank is going to be more balanced now. I was thinking of startnig a 29gallon mbuna tank, any suggestions for stocking?

(my sister has a 29gallon she wants to give me seeing as she just had a new baby boy*PEACE!* )

 

[Swordtail8]

Well, later on today, the original fish regained dominance which sucks. But there was cheer for the winner and I was cheering for him. Not too often do you get action like that in a tank that hasnt had too many changes to it in a long time.

 

[Swordtail8]

Here I am two days later. Another similar fight ended up happening again later that day with the same fish winning. But he wasnt fighting for dominance, he was fighting for territory. He now owns 1/3 of the tank while the other fish owns about 2/3 of the tank. The other larger fish have their hiding spots and the little fish run around and hide in corners when they are tired.

 

[ninamarie]

That was interresting to read about.
wasn't it scary to watch that.

I know that I would intervine and spank them and send them to their rooms.

glad that they all have managed to survive the brawls and set peace

 

[fishtrap]

glad that they all have managed to survive the brawls and set peace

Is that peace or merely a cease fire?

 

[YahooFishKeeper]

when my crays get in fights over treats (blood worms) i stick my hand in the tank and scare one away from the other. i dont want a dead cray.

 

[tubbs24]

Very very interesting. That sort of thing happened in my tank a little bit ago (except with platies, lol). I had a dominant male platy who never let the smaller male get to the females, but now the smaller male has gained superiority over the former-dominant male. Wierd how things work.

 

[Swordtail8]

I didn't intervene because I knew that the only way for the bully to lose dominance was to lose a fight. In the past I have taken him out and put him in a breeding net for awhile but that doesnt do anything. Whats funny now is that when the purple fish swims toward the blue fish's territory, he turns around and swims away.

Its funny now that every fish has its own obvious territory. I may add more rocks which can create more territories. Generally, if a mbuna survives the first week (or even just the first day), they will then live a long time then.

 

[calikas]

ive noticed that too,when theres a fight everyone gathers around to watch,good story

 

[kay-bee19]

How big are all your african cichlids; are they still small?

A 29-gal is too small to house mbuna long term due to their territorial nature. I think before your cichids reach full maturity (4" to 6" depending on species) the dominant one will pretty much claim the entire tank as its own, possibly inflicting a few unnecessy casualties along the way. A larger tank (55-gal+) would result in less aggressive tank as it provides more territory and room to flee.

Also, according to your stock list you have a frontosa. These relatively passive fish don't belong with mbuna and will get far too huge (12"-14") to remain in your 29-gal tank long-term.

 

[Exevious]

Yes...

your fish are killing each other because they are forced into a stressful environment.

IE: your tank is WAY TOO small and the mix is wrong.

I would not recommend any mbuna in a tank under 50g.
BUT if you really really want to do it... you should at least consider a spieces only tank with something like labs, no more than 5.

Check out the Cichlid forums at http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/

Lots of real research and great information!!

Just becareful not to post your current conditions... until you have a better understanding. The hobbyist there can be rather touchy about bad conditions.

 

[Exevious]

I must admit I am a little concerned by the responses here....

A fish battle should not recieve an entertainment response....

A fish battle should spark a troubleshooting response.

 

[Cichlid-Man]

I must admit I am a little concerned by the responses here....

A fish battle should not recieve an entertainment response....

A fish battle should spark a troubleshooting response.

I think this is in a whole different category then something like fighting bettas for fun.

Though you are right to an extent, this is one of the aspects that make cichlids so interesting to me. Their brawls and territorial aggression, watching it all play out is like diving into the lake itself and watching it. Its going to happen, you can't stop it. Even if you stop one brawl another will happen a few minutes later. Even if you take the dominant fish out of the tank...a new one will emerge.

So just enjoy cichlid behavior, yes its the fish you spent money on getting beat up and maybe even killed. There are some ways to help this, but you can't stop it totally. Like stocking, make sure your male/female stocking ratios are correct, make sure you have a big enough tank for the number of fish you have, and look at the number of fish you have...malawi cichlids tend to be overstocked for a reason.

 

[kay-bee19]

...make sure your male/female stocking ratios are correct, make sure you have a big enough tank for the number of fish you have, and look at the number of fish you have...malawi cichlids tend to be overstocked for a reason...

Great points which aren't being adopted in the tank in question.

Smaller tanks with few fish usually result in increased aggression. I think if those same fish were in a 75-gal with a few more other mbuna, the level of violence would be lower due to the availability of rivals and additional targets.

The dominant mbuna in my tank are the least violent. His presence alone is enough to break up fights or ward off challenges; his position is ensured to the point where he doesn't have to behave like a bully to gain respect from every other fish in the tank.

Most of the show downs in my tank are among the sub-dominants. Things never get out of hand because there are a lot of sub-dominants and if violence escalates my alpha male red zebra will bust it up quick.

I've yet to lose a mbuna to violence.

 

[BRANDX]

Wow, I have a 10g and everyone gave me all sorts of heck about having four fish in it! You, my friend, have much much fish.
Nice territory story! I wouldn't worry Exevious. My fish battle and for precicely the reason you stated forced to live in tight quarters, but equally for the reasons Cichlid-Man stated (nature of these fish). I really enjoy my aggressive cichlids, watching the territory struggle. Cheering for the underdog, but, I am still concerned about the well-being of my tank. I know I have to keep bumping up the tank size. And that is my fish adventure! Yes, they need some space, but what a great story Swordtail8.

 

[BRANDX]

PS

no fish were harmed for the posting of the previous response.

 

[Swordtail8]

Bumping an old thread I started to give an update. First, it is two years later but I never noticed the care bears posting in my thread about my tank being zomg too small, yata yata yata, I don't take to that kindly and do not want to even hear that kind of advice because I don't hold fish as highly as cats and dogs as others do here. I experiment to see what works and work with what I have. Sometimes fish die but so do the fish at Long John Silvers and Red Lobster and those fish are larger and have bigger brains.

The fish in question lived until I moved in 2007, in which I moved both my 10 gallon and 29 gallon 300 miles south in the winter with the only 3 casualties of the trip (24/27 lived). After moving them into the new tank setups, the fish did good for awhile but it was a peroid of my life where I didn't care much about fish. I was too lazy to make the huge rock/cave system I had before so several smaller ones died.

Over a year after the move, only 3 cichlids remain, the two fish involved in the battle. The blue fish that did the overthrow in the initial thread remains dominate to this day and has for more than a year now. The rock formation in my 29 gallon that has always been a feature in my tank setups (see my sig and the former community that existed before it) has had some rocks moved thanks to digging. I've a little orange cichlid left and he was put into the breeding nut because he was close to death. The frontosa died after I initially moved 3 months before moving my tank. My family negleted my tank and let him die, I was not happy.

While I have two awesome cichlids, I kinda want them to go away because I am sick of cichlids, I want to do a community tank like I had formerly. If I haul them 300 miles northward they can join my brother's brand new 55 gallon mbuna tank.

 

[Hamburgler]

I don't take to that kindly and do not want to even hear that kind of advice because I don't hold fish as highly as cats and dogs as others do here. I experiment to see what works and work with what I have.

Might i suggest you not bother communicating with other humans then? I'm not usually one to criticize, but your ignorance is crazy.