my nitrate and ph levels won't come down!

[fishymouse]

Help!!!
My tank is about 4 months old. For the last month, the PH and Nitrate levels are literally "off the charts"!!! Ammonia levels are ok, though. I have a 10 gallon tank with 3 guppies, 3 neons, 3 glo fish and 1 plecko. I have tried everything that i can think of....25% water change, 50% water change, mixing tap and bottled water, adding an aerator, stress zyme, ph down.....
What can i do to make the situation better?
Do I have too many fish??
The worse part is, one of my glo fish is suffering badly. He hangs on the bottom, doesn't eat, rarely swims and has a hump on his back! *SICK*
Please help!!!????

 

[jo3olous]

Help!!!
My tank is about 4 months old. For the last month, the PH and Nitrate levels are literally "off the charts"!!! Ammonia levels are ok, though. I have a 10 gallon tank with 3 guppies, 3 neons, 3 glo fish and 1 plecko. I have tried everything that i can think of....25% water change, 50% water change, mixing tap and bottled water, adding an aerator, stress zyme, ph down.....
What can i do to make the situation better?
Do I have too many fish??
The worse part is, one of my glo fish is suffering badly. He hangs on the bottom, doesn't eat, rarely swims and has a hump on his back! *SICK*
Please help!!!????

1. K first suggestion, no more chemicals. The only chemical you need is a de-chlorinator.
You should be siphoning about 40-50% of the water once a week, and adding dechlorinated water to the tank. 1 gallon of water only needs a drop or 2 of dechlorinator.

2. You have too many fish, and too man species. All the fish you have except the pleco prefer to be in schools. 3 is not a school. I would suggest returning 2 groups of fish and only keeping one, then having maybe 6-7 of that 1 group. Example: do JUST 6-7 guppies. No pleco is suitable for a 10G tank. Plecos are just too big a bioload for the size of your tank to handle. If it is a common pleco, definitely return it or re-home it. Common plecos grow over 16 inches in length, are a massive bioload to your tank. Although they are slow growers, I do not recommend them in tanks smaller than 75G. They can get aggressive towards other plecos when mature. Dwarf plecos would best suit you, but 20 gals minimum are recommended for most dwarf plecos.

3. An Aerator does NOTHING for your tank. I'm pretty sure you mean the bubble stones that make bubbles for your tank. They do NOTHING. It is purely aesthetics and provide little/no aeration to the tank. Your water can be oxygenated by agitating the surface. Hang on Back Filters (commonly used) and powerheads agitate the water well.


Not sure what your fish has but I would try SLOWLY turning up the temperature to about 84F. By slowly I mean you should turn the heater up a notch every few hours. The high temp should kill most bacteria. If it is some type of fungus on the fish you may need medication for it, but then this becomes a debate between saving a 3.00 fish with 15.00 medication, etc.

Hope this helps

 

[fishymouse]

jo3olous,
thanks for the advice.
question: i will re-home the pleco but do i need a different algae eater?

my guys are definitely already schooling together but i can see why we should limit the types and keep just one school. I don't have the heart to return so i am thinking it's time for a 2nd tank.
But if i stick with just guppies in this 10g tank, 7 is the max?

 

[jo3olous]

jo3olous,
thanks for the advice.
question: i will re-home the pleco but do i need a different algae eater?

my guys are definitely already schooling together but i can see why we should limit the types and keep just one school. I don't have the heart to return so i am thinking it's time for a 2nd tank.
But if i stick with just guppies in this 10g tank, 7 is the max?

Technically you do not. Algae will not build up in your tank unless you are doing excessive feeding, excessive lighting, or you could get the nasty brown algae (I don't know how people get this I never had it). However, having a bottom feeder or 2 does add the dimension of fish down low, since guppies like the mid/top areas. You could add 3 corys, or a group of ottos. Ottos are great cleaners and stay small but are very sensitive to water parameters. Those are just 2 of many choices. Any bottom feeder that stays < 2.5 inches you can basically add a few off and you would be OK.

I would say 7 is pushing it, in fact if you factor in that they are livebearers and you get AT least 1 m/f into the group and don't go all males you are bound for fry. You might start off with 6-7 guppies, but it could quickly turn into 30+++ over a month. Ask BMoraski about his, he has guppy tanks lol.

 

[fishymouse]

Technically you do not. Algae will not build up in your tank unless you are doing excessive feeding, excessive lighting, or you could get the nasty brown algae (I don't know how people get this I never had it). However, having a bottom feeder or 2 does add the dimension of fish down low, since guppies like the mid/top areas. You could add 3 corys, or a group of ottos. Ottos are great cleaners and stay small but are very sensitive to water parameters. Those are just 2 of many choices. Any bottom feeder that stays < 2.5 inches you can basically add a few off and you would be OK.

I would say 7 is pushing it, in fact if you factor in that they are livebearers and you get AT least 1 m/f into the group and don't go all males you are bound for fry. You might start off with 6-7 guppies, but it could quickly turn into 30+++ over a month. Ask BMoraski about his, he has guppy tanks lol.

Okay, thanx for the bottom feeder suggestions. Perhaps getting the pleco out and waiting about a week before i add the bottom feeders is the way to go.

I don't want 30++++ fish!!! Is a school of 6-7 males not cool? Will they start getting aggressive with each other?

 

[micah2012]

I love Ottos. I found that in my expierience they really aren't as sensitive to water parameters as people say. I've bought many since I started keeping fish and have never had one die. I litterally use them in all different tank enviroments with different parameters, I have even moved them from one tank to another. IDK maybe I've just been lucky.
Anyways yes a 10 gallon tank is very small for what you have, def find a new home for your pleco and for the reasons stated by Jo3olous I wouldn't recommend guppies. They WILL breed in your tank, guppies will breed in a puddle, lol

 

[homebunnyj]

6-7 males is a great idea.

Great advice from jo3. The only thing I can think of to add is that your pH remaining stable is much, much more important than the 'proper' pH. Your fish will get used to most any pH, but pH swings, even smallish ones, can kill them. This could be a contributing factor to your glofish's condition.

Post up the results in numbers for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate, and also pH since you seem worried about it. In the meantime, start following jo3's advice and don't even touch those pH adjusting products. Feed lightly unless you know the ammonia is at zero.

 

[MissFishy]

You don't need bottom feeders or algae eaters in a tank. Your tank is massively overstocked, so it is definitely time for a second tank or a much larger tank. Think of one inch of fish per gallon. One guppy is 2 inches, so in a ten gallon tank you could theoretically have 5 guppies ONLY.

The humped back danio/glofish is a common thing for danios to get. They will last for awhile but eventually will die.

 

[fishymouse]

The lfs has been testing my water and that's what's freaking me out!*crazysmil According to them, the # and types of fish i have are fine (i was thinking that sounded a little strange - especially after the responses to my questions!!)
The ph level is consistent at 7.8 - i know that it is high but if it is consistent and only one fish is suffering....could it be ok?
i read somewhere that glo fish are genetically susceptible to their back "humping"??? does that sound familiar?

 

[fishymouse]

thanks, missfishy - i had a feeling that the glofish hump back was a genetic thing after the research i did.
ok - i think a larger tank may be the answer after all.
i have found a good home for the pleco - a friend of mine has a 75g tank.

 

[homebunnyj]

There is nothing wrong with pH of 7.8, unless you are trying to breed some species of fish that is native to a lower pH.

To clarify: I meant that a school of 6-7 male guppies is fine, not necessarily that they are fine in a given size tank. Forgive my vagueness, I should have answered specifically to your size tank.

 

[MissFishy]

The PH levels are probably the LAST thing you should be worrying about. Ammonia and Nitrite are MUCH more deadly and important. Forget the PH levels.

 

[Matt Nace]

also sometimes there are nitrates in tap water....so you may be starting out higher than you expect each time you do a water change.

You said you do 25%, 50% water change..but how often? May have to increase the water changes and do as suggested..decrease your stock.

 

[Matt Nace]

Also forgot to add.

My PH is and has always been between 7.8 and 8.2 and never had any issues keeping any fish.

 

[1077]

Help!!!
My tank is about 4 months old. For the last month, the PH and Nitrate levels are literally "off the charts"!!! Ammonia levels are ok, though. I have a 10 gallon tank with 3 guppies, 3 neons, 3 glo fish and 1 plecko. I have tried everything that i can think of....25% water change, 50% water change, mixing tap and bottled water, adding an aerator, stress zyme, ph down.....
What can i do to make the situation better?
Do I have too many fish??
The worse part is, one of my glo fish is suffering badly. He hangs on the bottom, doesn't eat, rarely swims and has a hump on his back! *SICK*
Please help!!!????[/QUO

Glofish are a man made fish and as such, in my view,, are a genetically weak fish to begin with.
Nitrate levels are best controlled with water changes along with vaccuming a small area of the substrate each week during water changes. Also helps to not overfeed the fish. Were it me,(and it ain't) I would purchase a test kit such as API Freshwater master kit so that I could test my water without relying on fish store employees who often make mistakes. The strip style tests they sometimes use are not in my view,, all that accurate.

 

[1077]

1. K first suggestion, no more chemicals. The only chemical you need is a de-chlorinator.
You should be siphoning about 40-50% of the water once a week, and adding dechlorinated water to the tank. 1 gallon of water only needs a drop or 2 of dechlorinator.

2. You have too many fish, and too man species. All the fish you have except the pleco prefer to be in schools. 3 is not a school. I would suggest returning 2 groups of fish and only keeping one, then having maybe 6-7 of that 1 group. Example: do JUST 6-7 guppies. No pleco is suitable for a 10G tank. Plecos are just too big a bioload for the size of your tank to handle. If it is a common pleco, definitely return it or re-home it. Common plecos grow over 16 inches in length, are a massive bioload to your tank. Although they are slow growers, I do not recommend them in tanks smaller than 75G. They can get aggressive towards other plecos when mature. Dwarf plecos would best suit you, but 20 gals minimum are recommended for most dwarf plecos.

3. An Aerator does NOTHING for your tank. I'm pretty sure you mean the bubble stones that make bubbles for your tank. They do NOTHING. It is purely aesthetics and provide little/no aeration to the tank. Your water can be oxygenated by agitating the surface. Hang on Back Filters (commonly used) and powerheads agitate the water well.


Not sure what your fish has but I would try SLOWLY turning up the temperature to about 84F. By slowly I mean you should turn the heater up a notch every few hours. The high temp should kill most bacteria. If it is some type of fungus on the fish you may need medication for it, but then this becomes a debate between saving a 3.00 fish with 15.00 medication, etc.

Hope this helps

Glad you found home for the pleco which will help keep ammonia levels easier to manage. Can't agree with 50 percent water changes unless in emergency such as ammonia and or nitrite spike of lethal porportions. In ten gal tank with the bioload listed, two gal each week would suffice considering the pleco is gone. Small frequent water changes are less stressful on fish than large infrequent ones. While guppies would appreciate warmer water ,, Neons don't do well in temp much above 78 degrees in the long term. If oroiginal poster decides to up the temp then leaving the airstone for added oxygen might be a good idea.Have kept Discus in tanks with nothing but sponge filter powered by air pump. With temp in Discus tank of 86 to 90 degrees. They do provide oxygen by bubbles that agitate the surface.

 

[1077]

I love Ottos. I found that in my expierience they really aren't as sensitive to water parameters as people say. I've bought many since I started keeping fish and have never had one die. I litterally use them in all different tank enviroments with different parameters, I have even moved them from one tank to another. IDK maybe I've just been lucky.
Anyways yes a 10 gallon tank is very small for what you have, def find a new home for your pleco and for the reasons stated by Jo3olous I wouldn't recommend guppies. They WILL breed in your tank, guppies will breed in a puddle, lol

Many people (myself included) ,do report that otocinclus are indeed sensitive to sudden changes in water parameters. Especially ,,elevated NitrAtes. In general ,they seem to do poorly in new tanks and tanks with little or no algae which is their primary food source. Some have reported success with getting them to accept spirulina flake or algae wafers but many do not.

 

[1077]

You don't need bottom feeders or algae eaters in a tank. Your tank is massively overstocked, so it is definitely time for a second tank or a much larger tank. Think of one inch of fish per gallon. One guppy is 2 inches, so in a ten gallon tank you could theoretically have 5 guppies ONLY.

The humped back danio/glofish is a common thing for danios to get. They will last for awhile but eventually will die.

The one inch per gal recommendation is good general rule for new fish owners but it is seriously flawed. Example,,,, I could keep ten neon tetras in a ten gal tank with the one inch per gal rule. However I could NOT keep a ten inch Oscar in the same ten gal. Original poster could in my view keep a dozen neons if the tank has properly sized,and biologically healthy filter. For a ten gal tank with a dozen small fish either guppies or neons,, I would want filter rated for twenty gal tank and I would perform once a week two gal water changes while not overfeeding the fish.

 

[jo3olous]

The one inch per gal recommendation is good general rule for new fish owners but it is seriously flawed. Example,,,, I could keep ten neon tetras in a ten gal tank with the one inch per gal rule. However I could NOT keep a ten inch Oscar in the same ten gal. Original poster could in my view keep a dozen neons if the tank has properly sized,and biologically healthy filter. For a ten gal tank with a dozen small fish either guppies or neons,, I would want filter rated for twenty gal tank and I would perform once a week two gal water changes while not overfeeding the fish.

I don't think you know the 1 inch per gallon rule very well if you think this. It's implied that the 1 inch per gallon rule applies to tanks < 20G and fish that grow < 4inches. Fish that are 5inches and up tend to vary in bioloads, making it a pain to know how many inches of fish you can stock. However your are correct in that the fish per gallon rule is inaccurate. You can put 10 tetras in a 10G, however you cannot put 10 danios in a 10G. You cannot put 4 danios in a 10G. Danios are active swimmers and need lots of room so they can be active; Danios are also occassional fin nippers so fancy tailed fish should not be with them; Danios are also jumpers so the owner should have a tight lid on the tank. The inch per gallon rule is meant to be taken with a grain of salt, and it's a general consensus to go by. That is why forums have people like me to tell inquirers more about tendencies/habits fish have that they would like to keep or already have. *thumbsups

 

[1077]

Am 53 years young and have kept fish since the early 1970's.
Never heard any mention of the stipulation as to tank sizes of less than 20 gal nor of fish that do not exceed four inches. I agree that that info would make it a little more plausible. Also agree that danios, with the exception of giant danios ,would be best suited for twenty gal long or larger as opposed to ten gal. I made no mention of them for that reason. In any event,, the one inch per gal rule is as stated flawed in it's basic principal yet many site it as pertinent. I have kept cichlids in tanks that many would view as overstocked yet with proper filtration and proper maint it can and is being done by many.