Helping the cycle along...

jingles

jingles

Medium Fish
#21
Jan 28, 2009
76
0
0
Auburn, AL
#21
um..sorry what I meant by overfiltering is I believe it will make the cycle take longer BUT i don't have any evidence to support this. Yea the only way you'll tell if your really over filtering you tank is if your fish can not swim..but I can't see that happening. So sorry for the confusion.

Back to the cycling for your tank to start cycling there will need to be an ammonia spike(of some sort) so the bacteria can convert it to NO2(nitrite) and once you have that your filter media can convert that to nitrates and yad yad yadda..that was just a long way to say yes.
 

KyleBradley

KyleBradley

Large Fish
#22
Feb 13, 2006
143
0
0
Massachusetts
#22
Wow... Last night I purchased a bottle of clear ammonia, but it doesn't say anywhere on the bottle what percentage it is.. What I've read is that it should be 9% concentration. All I know is that what I bought is STRONG when you try to smell it, so it's probably the standard concentration.

Anyway, I read that I should start with 5 drops per 10 gallons, so I put the ammonia into an old indicator solution bottle that I had after I rinsed it out. This way I could count the drops.. I started with 15 drops and checked the ammonia-no rise.. I added 15 more-no rise.. I added 45 drops total last night, and when I got up this morning and checked it, it's still no higher than 0.25ppm.. What gives?
 

DclownD

DclownD

Large Fish
#23
Jul 11, 2006
477
1
0
Syracuse, Ny
#23
to be honest i hate to say this but last time i started my tank up i i did a fish in cycle with some mollys and i saw lvls fast. the pure ammonia should show readings after a couple hours i would imagine so its put through the water. I would say dose it again today and keep checking the ammonia lvls hopefully you will see ups and downs.

Edit: Did you transfer any media from a running tank such as gravel or filters?
 

KyleBradley

KyleBradley

Large Fish
#24
Feb 13, 2006
143
0
0
Massachusetts
#24
DclownD said:
Edit: Did you transfer any media from a running tank such as gravel or filters?
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Yes, when I first started this tank up last Friday I took the media from my established 20-gallon tank and put it in the new tank's filter. I purposely bought the same filter so that I could do this, and I've had great luck with the Emperor 280, anyway.. I did this again last night-switched filters. Someone in this thread said that if I did that cycling wouldn't be necessary, as it would happen very rapidly, with the bacteria doubling every .. Was blue_ram right? I'm going to take his advice and check for nitrates.
 

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DclownD

DclownD

Large Fish
#25
Jul 11, 2006
477
1
0
Syracuse, Ny
#25
yeah just keep dosing the ammonia or your bacteria will die id say ad a bit o gravel from the other one in a net or something just to speed it up more and keep an eye for your nitrate if all goes well yeah thats the way to jump start a tank
 

KyleBradley

KyleBradley

Large Fish
#26
Feb 13, 2006
143
0
0
Massachusetts
#26
DclownD said:
yeah just keep dosing the ammonia or your bacteria will die id say ad a bit o gravel from the other one in a net or something just to speed it up more and keep an eye for your nitrate if all goes well yeah thats the way to jump start a tank
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I'd say that I'm looking at a pretty un-cycled tank by looking at these levels-what do you think?

I just took these readings today, 8/7, at 11:00








 

KyleBradley

KyleBradley

Large Fish
#30
Feb 13, 2006
143
0
0
Massachusetts
#30
Well, I went for it tonight... Ready or not-here they come!! I went to Petco and bought 8 guppies.. I really wanted neons, but they had only 1, and I wasn't about to buy just one of a schooling fish... So I bought beautiful male guppies... And then I moved my 5 Opaline Gouramis over, the two discus over, the two tetras over and that's about it...

I also bought Ammo-Carb charcoal just in cast the ammonia spikes.. Since I have the Emperor 280, I have a carbon cartridge I can fill with that in order to get rid of ammonia, but so far none..

And left in the 20-gallon hex that I'm having cloudiness problems with are 3 corydoras... I removed the filter media and carbon carriers and added two capfuls of a clearing solution for cloudy water... I will put the media and carbon back in 48 hours, as suggested...

But the 35 gallon is very lively!! I do expect some guppy die-off, as they aren't very hardy, but the crayfish should take care of that pretty reliably.. One guppy has already separated itself form the group and is up in the corner swimming against the current of the Emperor.. He's likely a goner! I've only had the crayfish for 2 days, and I've already had to remove a moulting...
 

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O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#32
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
0
36
#32
KyleBradley said:
Well, I went for it tonight... Ready or not-here they come!! I went to Petco and bought 8 guppies.. I really wanted neons, but they had only 1, and I wasn't about to buy just one of a schooling fish... So I bought beautiful male guppies... And then I moved my 5 Opaline Gouramis over, the two discus over, the two tetras over and that's about it...

I also bought Ammo-Carb charcoal just in cast the ammonia spikes.. Since I have the Emperor 280, I have a carbon cartridge I can fill with that in order to get rid of ammonia, but so far none..

And left in the 20-gallon hex that I'm having cloudiness problems with are 3 corydoras... I removed the filter media and carbon carriers and added two capfuls of a clearing solution for cloudy water... I will put the media and carbon back in 48 hours, as suggested...

But the 35 gallon is very lively!! I do expect some guppy die-off, as they aren't very hardy, but the crayfish should take care of that pretty reliably.. One guppy has already separated itself form the group and is up in the corner swimming against the current of the Emperor.. He's likely a goner! I've only had the crayfish for 2 days, and I've already had to remove a moulting...
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Oh my goodness......:( Why would you want to deliberately hurt the fish you just purchased? To each his own I guess...

All you needed was PRIME to detoxify the ammonia, and more patience.

Did you honestly put all those fish in the tank?
 

DclownD

DclownD

Large Fish
#33
Jul 11, 2006
477
1
0
Syracuse, Ny
#33
well as he said his levels are zero its possible he has cycled his tank and the bacteria are there. he used established media if you read all of the posts. so its possible he is good to go im not 100% on the discus lol
 

KyleBradley

KyleBradley

Large Fish
#34
Feb 13, 2006
143
0
0
Massachusetts
#34
OrangeCones said:
Oh my goodness......:( Why would you want to deliberately hurt the fish you just purchased? To each his own I guess...

All you needed was PRIME to detoxify the ammonia, and more patience.

Did you honestly put all those fish in the tank?
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Oh, I absolutely wouldn't want to harm them.. My ammonia is a zero, and the crayfish appeared very healthy.. I've been taking readings regularly and adding insane amounts of ammonia, only to have it read zero when tested again.. I suspected something was wrong with my brand new test kit, so I put some ammonia in a cup of water and tested it, and it was through the roof!! GREEN!!!

I did put all those fish in there, and today we took a trip. We just returned home at 22:00, and it looked like a massive amount of die-off of the guppies, because there were 5 down on the bottom of the tank in the gravel... Now get this-this amazed me.. I unplugged the UG filter, and the fish are all swimming around, apparently healthy as could be.. I NEVER would have thought that an undergravel filter pulled like that!!! It's as if they were being held down to that bottom of the tank..

Anyway, they entire tank is swimming lively and eating, but the one guy I did lose is one of the crayfish... The guy who just molted was upside down when I got home.. Can't figure that one out, as they are supposed to be pretty hardy..

I did an immediate ammonia check, and it's still 0-0.25.

While I was typing this, a gourami just swam through the log on the bottom of the tank! Those guys have to be the best fish to watch, as they occupy all levels of the tank! They just go wherever they want, and they chase each other around... That was funny, but that's the crayfish's hide-out, so I hope he doesn't go through when the crustacean is home!
 

KyleBradley

KyleBradley

Large Fish
#35
Feb 13, 2006
143
0
0
Massachusetts
#35
DclownD said:
well as he said his levels are zero its possible he has cycled his tank and the bacteria are there. he used established media if you read all of the posts. so its possible he is good to go im not 100% on the discus lol
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I'm not sure on the discus, either! I don't know a lot of fish by sight, just the most common, and these two guys like like tetras to me, but the guy that I buy them from runs a fish store out of his garage, so his word isn't always right! Anyway, they're very healthy so far.

The one thing that's puzzling me is that the guppies aren't staying together.. I thought they liked to be in groups, and that's why I bought 8 of them, but as I look at the tank, which sits just to my right as I sit here, 4 are in the bottom center, 1 is top left in the current of the Emperor, two are under the feeding ring, and one is swimming bottom right...
 

DclownD

DclownD

Large Fish
#36
Jul 11, 2006
477
1
0
Syracuse, Ny
#36
the guppies my wife made me buy did there own thing back in the day as did mollys the couple schooling fish i had were tiger barbs and neon tetra (not at the same time) all the tetras i kept getting were sick
 

B

BlueStraggler

Large Fish
#37
Mar 13, 2009
314
0
0
Poconos, PA
#37
Yeah guppies aren't schooling fish though when a male sees a female he'll chase her around. lol.

The tank seems cycled to me because when I added pure ammonia to start my cycle the ammonia showed up on the tests right away. (I gave it a few minutes to circulate before testing)

A surprise to me was how quickly the tank cycled with this method (2 weeks! When I expected at least 4-6)

I believe (as was already stated) that seeding your tank with the media gave you an instant cycle. And I'm sorry to hear that your ug filter killed some fish.

Hope you continue to have success in this.

ps. A lot of people will tell you that keeping discus is not difficult at all. If you can do your water changes regularly...you can keep discus.
I do recommend keeping the hardier species until you are comfortable enough with your experience and learned knowledge before trying the less hardier ones.
 

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KyleBradley

KyleBradley

Large Fish
#38
Feb 13, 2006
143
0
0
Massachusetts
#38
BlueStraggler said:
And I'm sorry to hear that your ug filter killed some fish.
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The funny thing is that it didn't kill any fish.. They were apparently dead around the perimeter of the tank (which should have triggered some warning) as they were lying between the glass and the gravel, but when I unplugged the UG filter, they were up and about.. They are all still alive as I type this! I can't believe that I bought 8 guppies more than 48 hours ago and they're all still alive... *thumbsups

The one fish that has died during this is the crayfish who molted, and I don't know that what pansy's problem was! But he's swimming in the sewer now, as I flushed his corpse.. But the tank appears healthy with all fish swimming very actively..

I've never heard and an Instant Cycle, but I guess cycling a tank in 4 days qualifies!! I'm going to do a complete water test in a few to see what my levels are..
 

pigpen

pigpen

Small Fish
#39
Jun 23, 2009
29
0
0
#39
took me over 2 months to cycle my 45 ,fish in cycle that is.my 133 will not be a fish in cycle.but now that the 33 is good it will make the 133 come around so much easier i cant wait to get it up and running
 

O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#40
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
0
36
#40
KyleBradley said:
The one fish that has died during this is the crayfish who molted, and I don't know that what pansy's problem was!
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Until their new shell hardens, they are very vulnerable. The other crayfish or the other occupants of the tank could have hurt him. Make sure there are several hiding places for the other to retreat to after molting.
 

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