The tank that will not cycle.

Nostrathomas

Nostrathomas

Small Fish
#1
Oct 28, 2009
30
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#1
I have a 55 gallon tank, which has been set up for a little over 2 months, and the ammonia levels are just as high now as they were 3 days after I got the filter for it. I had some baby sailfin mollies in it, who, up until last nite, were doing fine. They began breathing heavily and looked terrible so I moved them to another tank, where they seem to be ok now. I'm not brand spanking new to aquariums, I have an established 45 gallon, which has been set up for nearly a year now, and I've had little to no trouble with it. The nitrates occasionally get high, but that is fixed easily enough by vacuuming the gravel and cleaning the filter. The fish in there are thriving, a couple angelfish even breeding. About a month into what I thought was the cycle of the 55 gallon, I added some Amquel+ to the tank, since ammonia levels were still very high. It clearly states on the bottle that it will not interfere with the cycling process, and everything I've read online about it claims the same thing. After 9 weeks or so into letting the tank run, nearly daily water changes, usually about 20%, once a 50%, feeding only every other day, removing half the fish, so that there are only 4 small fish in it now, and the ammonia STILL hasn't gone down. My 45 took about a month to cycle, and as I stated above, I've had very little trouble with it, but the 55 is rapidly becoming the bane of my existence. Could it be the difference in filters? On the 45 I have a Rena Filstar canister filter for a 75 gallon tank. The 55 has a Penguin 350 Bio-Wheel, which claims to be for tanks up to 70 gallons. The guy at the fish store said the filter has nothing to do with it. If this is true, the only other thing I can blame it the Amquel+, since it's the only thing I did differently from the 45. Any advice, tips, and whatnot would be appreciated, as I'm about 2 days away from taking all the water out and maybe adding a hamster or something.
 

Nostrathomas

Nostrathomas

Small Fish
#3
Oct 28, 2009
30
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#3
The tank that will not cycle

I'm using the API master test kit. I'm aware that the ammonia can only be detoxified, and will still show up on most test kits, mine included, but the fact that the fish are showing obvious symptoms of ammonia poisoning leads me to believe that the ammonia is indeed high and hardly non-toxic. Why it would still be this way after 9 weeks is beyond me, unless the Amquel disrupted the cycle, and set it back to day one. Adding the Amquel is the only thing I did differently from my other tank, which is fine. I've removed all the fish now, 3 dead, 5 alive, and am not going to put another chemical in this tank and just let it do it's thing. I will put fish back in once I start seeing some nitrates (I've never seen a tank that had readable nitrate and ammonia levels simultaneously) and tell everyone I know not to pollute their tanks with Amquel. I could very well be wrong...time will tell. Thank you for your input. I appreciate it.
 

Nostrathomas

Nostrathomas

Small Fish
#5
Oct 28, 2009
30
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#5
No, have had no nitrites show up at all, it's as if the tank either simply didn't cycle or something interfered with the cycle. The PH stays right at 6.4. It's all very odd to me as the only fish that show any sign of distress are the mollies. There were also 3 platies in there, along with 3 zebra danios, and one black lace angel, who was there temporarily due to being bullied in another tank. I now have the mollies in a 14 gallon quarantine tank and they appear to be recovering. The other fish seemed to be oblivious to any trouble in the water, but I removed them anyway. On some days I do the nitrite test first with high hopes that I'll see some, but 9 weeks later and I've yet to see anything but light blue-0. Of the big three the only one that has shown at all is ammonia. I stopped doing water changes after testing the tap water showed ammonia in it as well, although not as much. Ammonia reads 0 in the 45, and there is no readable amount in the quarantine tank either.
 

O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#6
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
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#6
I have small amounts of ammonia as well in my tap water, so always use Prime as my dechlor. Amquel Plus works the same way according to the manufacturer's website, in that it binds the ammonia but leaves it available for the biological filter to consume.

Sure is perplexing. I'd say a faulty test kit or 'user error' on testing (that is all to common), but you've tested your other aquarium and get what sounds like 'correct' results from it, so its safe to rule out either of those as the problem.

Can you seed the 55 with some rocks/gravel/filter media from the established 45?
 

Nostrathomas

Nostrathomas

Small Fish
#7
Oct 28, 2009
30
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#7
That is precisely what I did initially. I took some of the media from the filter and squeezed it into the water, hoping it would speed things up. It could be that it wasn't enough, but I will try it again tonite since the tank is fishless now. It could very well be that the test kit is faulty, but in the tanks where everything reads as it should the fish seem fine,so I really don't know. I plan to take a sample to the pet store toomorrow and have them test it and see if they get the same results. Despite what I said in my previous post, I'm not ready to give up on this tank just yet. I appreciate your input, and if you have any other advice, I'm all eyes.
 

sheamurai

sheamurai

Small Fish
#8
Jul 1, 2009
39
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#8
Next time you clean your canister filter, I'd replace the filter floss/pad in it and take the old stuff that you replaced (and maybe some of the bio-media as well) and put it in the penguin until your ammonia starts to drop...
 

Nostrathomas

Nostrathomas

Small Fish
#10
Oct 28, 2009
30
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0
#10
Ok, I now have some of the filter media from the 45 in the 55. I took a water sample from the 55 into the fish shop to have it tested. Their test also read high levels of ammonia, so I'm almost certain now my kits not faulty. I told the manager there about using Amquel+, and he told me that it will indeed interrupt the cycle, despite their claims otherwise. He also told me that they won't even carry that crap at the store. It's not difficult to understand why. So, basically, had I not used the Amquel my tank would've been cycled already. On their website they have some info about their tests showing no signs of their fine, fine product disrupting the cycle. So, it seems to me one of 2 things is happening here. #1 THEIR tests are faulty or #2- They know damn well what it does, but won't tell anybody because their job is to move product. Well, I moved some of their product today, from the shelf to the toilet. I felt sort of guilty about polluting the sewer with this vile crap, but I'm certain it will recover faster than my fish tank.
 

Newman

Newman

Elite Fish
#11
Sep 22, 2009
4,668
0
0
Northern NJ
#11
Nostrathomas said:
because their job is to move product. Well, I moved some of their product today, from the shelf to the toilet. I felt sort of guilty about polluting the sewer with this vile crap, but I'm certain it will recover faster than my fish tank.
Click to expand...
ROFL

your tank should do well now. give it even more time (like you havent already xD)

Best of luck.
 

Newman

Newman

Elite Fish
#19
Sep 22, 2009
4,668
0
0
Northern NJ
#19
Prime is another good water conditioner. most do their job well. i wont endorce prime tho...people might start jumping down my throat for using the expesive stuff.

Theres one thing i dont like about prime though, its lack of a dropper cap. it can easily be remedied by just poking one hole in the white stira-foam sealing cover.
 

Nostrathomas

Nostrathomas

Small Fish
#20
Oct 28, 2009
30
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0
#20
I've decided to take some advice and just leave the tank be and let it do it's thing. There are no fish in it all all now, so there won't be any emergencies. As much as I like blaming Amquel for my troubles (Not that I'm gonna stop, lol) the truth is I got too impatient to add fish. I won't let this happen again. I might purchase Amquel again to use, oh, let's say, if I have a houseguest that doesn't want to leave. I could then simply open the noxious smelling stuff and hide it, this would surely speed up their departure. Or, maybe Amquel would be good as a paint remover, or for tough laundry stains......I believe there is some good in everything, and Amquel is something, which is a part of everything, so there has to be something it can be used for.
 

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