Wnat is the best wat to add API Quick start and API Aquarium salt during a PWC?

[Doodeybumps]

Hello again,

Sorry for so many questions!! My two comet Goldfish were struggling with Ammonia poisoning in a 1 gallon fish bowl. In the last 24 hours I have finally finished the move over into a bigger tank (only 63 litres, but certainly better). The fish had black marks on their gills, heads, fins and sides. These marks are all gone on one fish and rapidly disappearing on the other. Due to the urgent need to re-home the fish the new tank was uncycled. To avoid too much shock while I moved the fish I floated the old bowl in the new tank without water exchange for 24hrs. Tested the water, all fine and well matched. Allowed water to lap between the two tanks for 24 hrs, without leaving room for fish to swim over the top. and then yesterday evening I added the last of the water, the fish swam over in to the new tank and I took out the old bowl. I didn't use any new water treatment during the move to avoid too many changes all at once. However, over the last week the fish appear to be losing scales. At first I thought this was ich because it left white patches, but I am not seeing any grazing on ornaments or tank sides. I think this may just be another stage in the recovery from the horrible bowl. Behaviour has improved since the move and appetite is good in both fish. I am concerned it could be my tank decorations (I have attached some pictures). In the next PWC I want to add aquarium salt and quick start in addition to my stress coat water conditioner. I have two small buckets and a 15 litre water container for adding water to the aquarium, but I am unsure of the best way to add these three things in conjuction. Does stress coat treated water need to be left to stand before I add it to the aquarium like my previous water conditioner did? Should I only add the dosage of salt and quickstart required to treat the water I am replacing or to treat the whole tank? Can I add all three in the same batch of water? How often is it safe to redose, if you treat the whole tank? When you redose do you only dose for the quantity of replaced water or for the entire tank volume?
P.s. I Probably seem really thick, I don't think that I am, possibly just over anxious due to the trainwreck of a fishkeeper I have been so far! I have looked at previous threads to find the answers and I loved the introduction to fish keeping, it was really helpful. My questions just seem to be too specific! Thank you once again, for all your support.

 

[Doodeybumps]

I realise the two typos in the thread title don't support my argument that I am not just really thick and I suppose that my inability to work out how to fix them doesn't either!

 

[FreshyFresh]

I wouldn't add either of those API products. Just do regular water changes with dechlorinated water and measure water parameters for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate.

You can have 100% dechlorinated tap water in your tank and your fish will love you for it. There's no harm in that at all. Eventually, when all you see is nitrates, partial water changes will suffice.

 

[Rotaripsnoc]

I agree with FF, QuickStart may have some benefit, but I've never seen it cycle a tank any faster than without it, and the salt will cause the fish to thicken their slime coat, so the stress coat is not needed.

Salt acts like a natural laxative for fish, so you may need to vacuum their tank the next day after introducing salt. Usually I introduce salt slowly, 0.2 oz / gal or 0.56 g / 3.7 liter let the fish swim in that for a day, if no ill affects ( there shouldn't be ) increase it to 0.4 oz / gal, a word of caution, this will throw off your nitrite tests, you may want to have your local fish store test for nitrites weekly before your water changes, advise them the tank is salted, so they use the correct test.

Don't worry about questions etc, that's why we're here. Here was my catastrophic re-entry into the hobby: http://www.myfishtank.net/forum/fre...-preparation-hoping-confirmation-problem.html might help you feel better about what you have experienced.

 

[Thyra]

I also agree with FF and wouldn't add anything including the salt. Just leave the fish alone and do regular water changes until you can get your own test kit.

 

[Doodeybumps]

I have just finished reading Rotaripsnoc's thread about Jack and I feel very impressed and a little reassured that you managed to pull him through, nice job!! I have never used any forums before this one I just found so much conflicting info using research alone that I felt completely lost and I have spent a fortune ordering water treatments and chemicals. All the experts on this forum have really helped.I have the API Freshwater test Kit and I have been doing regular 30% PWCs (originally 3 times a day now down to 2) since it arrived over a week ago and the black gills fiasco. My original readings were off the chart bad in all three areas. Now the ammonia and Nitrite readings are around the 0 to 0.25 level, but the Nitrate still looks pretty high despite the frequent PWCs. In your thread you mentioned Ammonia readings of 0.02, how on earth do you obtain such accurate measures? I will hold off on the salt and quickstart. Should I do anything about the loss of scales?

 

[Rotaripsnoc]

The loss of scales is probably due to ammonia poisoning, they will probably grow back, with exposed skin, I would now disregard the salt, as it could cause further damage. just keep up with your water changes 0.02 was probably a typo or reduced to make the lines on the graph closer to more easily see correlations.

Also if you Nitrites are not lowering with water changes, and your tap tests at 0 ppm, increase your water changes, from 30 % as long as the fish have enough water to cover their fins when swimming upright, it's safe to remove everything else.

Ex: Jack is about 3.5 " tall, so I leave about 4 " of water in the tank, my 60 gal is 18 " tall so that's about a 75 % water change.

 

[Doodeybumps]

Thankyou, I don't really understand how I am getting all these nitrates, surely I wouldn't have much nitrifying bacteria in a teeny-tiny filter that had been in a 1 gallon bowl for just over 3 weeks?! I have just treated 15 litres of tap water with stress coat and left it to stand I will test some of that before I add it. If I do a very large water change, how to I treat all the water and leave it to stand for declorinator to work and temp to adjust. Do I treat one container, leave to stand, add it, then repeat until tank is full. Or am I worrying too much about letting the water stand?

 

[Rotaripsnoc]

I usually adjust our water from faucet ( older home has a faucet that I can attach a hose to. ) to the same temp as the tank, and treat the water as it's added to the tank. I put the end of the hose in a gallon container, and add about half of the dechlorinator to the container, and add the other directly into the tank. However I've discovered the tap in my city has diffused C02 so I'll be putting it into a drum to sit before adding it to the tank.

 

[FreshyFresh]

Thankyou, I don't really understand how I am getting all these nitrates,.......

Forgive me if we've discussed this in your other thread, but have you measured nitrates in your tap water?

I've seen reports from others in the hobby from the UK that had 20-40ppm nitrates, right out of the tap.

That being the case, I'd just be sure to do a large weekly water change. Not ideal, but from what I've read, most fish will adjust just fine to the higher nitrates provided you still keep up on your weekly water changes.

 

[Doodeybumps]

No, I hadn't tested nitrates. Based on what I had read I had assumed these would be zero. I had tested the ammonia and that was fine and the PH, which was 8.2, ok but not great. I just tested the Nitrate, it is in the 40 to 80 region, closer to 40 I think (they look virtually identical to me on the colour chart). This is pants!! And Mannel now has a ripped anal fin. When I have kept small mammals people have said things like "Why didn't you get something easy, like a goldfish!". I feel I have been grossly misled, they are fussy little things and they consume most of what should be leisure time with staring, water testing, water changing, worrying and posting on this forum. With my terrible tap water, is this ever going to get any better. Stupid as it sounds I love them now, but I would like at least some of what used to be my life back!

 

[Doodeybumps]

GoldFish Emergency 911 - Symptoms and Ailments

Just looked up high nitrates on the web, found this horrible website. These poor fish look ghastly. I am particularly bothered by the fish with missing scales and ripped fins caused by bacterial infections which are promoted by high nitrate levels. Oh dear, I fear the future is bleak for Trevor and Mannel!

 

[Thyra]

Is there something wrong with your tap water? I can't remember you saying there was and if you are talking about an 8.2 pH I suspect half of us on this forum have a pH in that neighborhood. I know mine is at least that. IMO you need to relax a bit and stop fussing. Just do a daily 50% water change and let things get better. You may be surprised - I hope!

 

[Rotaripsnoc]

If your nitrites from tap are running 40ppm + you're going to have lots of algae, algae will consume nitrates and lower your tank's nitrate levels, it will take some time though. Looks like Britain water board deems anything less than 50 ppm safe for consumption, so you're probably in the 50 or less group. I would add some melafix or a drop of pure tea tree extract to your tank to treat the split fin \ fin rot that is developing, it will also help the area's where there were lost scales.

 

[Thyra]

Did you really mean the nitrItes are running 40ppm right from the tape? I've heard nitrAtes could be high in tape water, but never heard that about nitrItes.

 

[Rotaripsnoc]

I intended NitrAtes.