Changing out the UGF

[FroggyFox]

Hey all, I just got a HOB filter for my 10G today to replace my UGF.

I have it set up and running. I unplugged the ugf (OH Heavenly SILENCE!) and am now just starting to think about that.

Should I keep the ugf running until the new filter gets a chance to get some bacteria built up?

Hey, but the good news is that my fish are LOVIN the stream of water The rasboras are practically doing somersaults in the water!

 

[lizwinz]

when i changed out my ugf i did the folowing:

kept both running on the tank for 2 weeks...if you unplug the ugf alot of the bacteria in the gravel will die from lack of circulating oxygen & food

when i took the ugf out for good i took out the plates, let everything settle, vaccumed and them took a large net and cut the netting out, filled it loosely with gravel and put it behind the filter pad in the hob to help seed the media better

i didnt have any ammonia or nitrite spikes

you could always fishless cycle it on a different container too

--liz

 

[FroggyFox]

I would have done it with a different container...but I don't have one around. I think I'll just leave them both in there for awhile. I'd like to get some more gravel, so maybe in a month or so I'll pick up some more gravel and do a redecorating on the tank, hopefully the new one will be seeded by then. Thanks Liz!

 

[pyackel]

Oh boy! Never turn off a UGF for more than an hour! If you do anaerobic bacteria will begin to prosper and create hydrogen sulfide as a by-product. Your best bet is to keep it running in tandem with your HOB filter. Since you already have unplugged it plug it back in, vacuum the gravel and start doing water changes - otherwise you are headed for distaster. You will likely need to recycle the tank if it has been unplugged for more than a day. Good luck!

 

[FroggyFox]

I plugged it back in right after I posted this thread. Note that I only first posted the thread an hour ago pyackel.

 

[Fishman_2000]

Pyachel I think you are incorrect in saying she would have to re-cycle the tank if it was down for a day. The bacteria is pretty strong and doesn't die so quickly. We had a bad ice storm here last December and I didn't have power for 3 days. I had a good amount of fish in my 20 gallon and only lost the 2 rasboras and I heard they don't take very cold temperatures very well. All the other fish lived and I checked the ammonia levels daily and never had a spike! Another story is I changed the media in my canister filter. Then I needed to setup a hospital tank at the spur of a moment. The sponge had been in my trashcan for a day or two. I took it out and threw it into the hospital tank in front of the filter I had in there. All of the ammonia and nitrite levels were fine everytime I checked it. I have heard about the anaerobic bacteria forming so the water change is a good idea if the filters have been down for a long time. But I never did a water change when I got power back. I just changed the water again at the normal time.

 

[Fishman_2000]

Froggy leaving both filters running for a few weeks is a good idea. What I would do is after a few weeks is turn off the UGF filter for a week or two but leave it in the tank. Monitor your Ammonia and nitrite levels just to make sure that you have enough bacteria built up in your HOB filter. Better to be safe then sorry! I'd add the gravel after you know your bacteria is in good working order!

 

[FroggyFox]

Thanks fishman, I will definitely leave them both in for awhile. I'm not really in a hurry to get more rock in there and take the tank down to take the UGF out, so I'm willing to leave the old UGF in there as long as I need to

 

[pyackel]

ABSOLUTLEY NOT! Do not turn off th UGF unless you are going to remove it imediately. This is not an opinion, but a fact.

 

[FroggyFox]

HOW is that a fact Pyackel? Have you done it before?

What does everyone else think?

Its not as if I would just turn the UGF off and then never touch the gravel. I will continue doing normal tank maintenance (water changes and gravel vac every week), leave both filters running for several weeks and then start turning the ugf off or turning the air down. Monitoring the ammonia/nitrite levels to see if the HOB filter has established itself well enough. Then when I turn the UGF off I'll leave it in for a few days (to make sure) and then take the UGF out.

This doesn't seem that complicated to me.

 

[pyackel]

I hope this will be of help: http://www.bestfish.com/ug2.html
http://www.athiel.com/lib/ugfilterarticle.htm

(This is a well known & documented issue in the aquaria world)

 

[FroggyFox]

Anyone else?

I tend to disagree with this. The article that Pyackel linked to says that its not the bacteria, but the waste that has built up underneath the plates that could be toxic. There was also another article on the site about how to remove the UGF and it didn't have anything about how to reestablish bacteria in the HOB Filter.

This tank has been set up for less than 2 months, and I've been doing regular cleaning. Also, like I mentioned before, I don't have much gravel in there, so not as many places for the "nasties" to have gathered.

 

[pyackel]

Look - I don't come here to be confrontational. Nor do I offer advice that is not without merit. The article says: " If water flow is halted, oxygen becomes unavailable in the gravel, and these same waste products break down anaerobically into much more noxious compounds like hydrogen sulfide and methane. If you choose to discontinue a UGF, it should be removed completely, and you should be prepared to deal with a huge release of organic waste". Okay, that anaerobic breakdown of detritus is caused by one thing and one thing only - anaerobic bacteria. I am simply trying to help you. Being that it is a relatively new setup you may escape without the anaerobic bacteria becoming an issue - and I should have asked how old the setup was. I don't want to sound like an "arrogant know it all" but I would like to give you my educational background. I have Masters Degree in Organic Chemistry and a PHD in MicroBiology. I am not by any means bragging - I just want you to know that I do know what I am talking about on this issue. I am offering you my expert opinion - thats all. I hope all turns out well.

 

[FroggyFox]

Look Pyackel, thanks for your expert opinion. However, I know from a couple months of being here that you have to take eveyrone's opinions with a grain of salt.

You HAVE sounded like an arrogant know it all. I respect that you have been through many years of school and that you are book smart, but to me that doesn't mean your expert opinion is worth more than someone who has had fishtanks for a long time and gone through this exact thing before.

 

[pyackel]

But I have been doing this for over 24 years! I have both the educational and experiencial background to offer. I'm sorry for trying to help you.

 

[Finding Nemo]

froggyfox1, pyackel is 100% correct about the not turning off an undergravel filter. i did it to mine a couple of months ago and boy what a mess! 10 out of my 14 fish died within a week. why did you get so mean towards him - he's just trying to help you out.

 

[Leopardess]

alright alright...how does donna summers name appear in a phone book? that's right, say it faster..good...faster...come on, faster! that's right! SIMMA DOWN NA!


DEEEP BREATHS ALL. Ok, perhaps froggy was slightly harsh () but she is usually very calm and well intentioned, so we are going to give her the "bad day" exception Other than that, I think she was merely asking for a few other opinions on the subject...when all she was really getting after a certain point was pyackel's advice- which I have no clue about whether he's right or wrong. And it doesn't matter either way because it is just his opinion.

Nemo, asking questions like yours is just going to create a bickering back and forth, I think it would be best to not stir the pot, if you know what I mean.

SO, does anyone else have anything for or against what pyackel advises?

 

[pyackel]

I'm confused Leopardess. Why would it not matter if I was right? It certainly matters to me whether information is right or wrong. (just asking )

 

[FroggyFox]

Around here I dont' think whether advice is right or wrong is the biggest thing...because a lot of people are just extremely opinionated and a lot of things that have to do with fishkeeping are up for interpretation. Some things work for some people, and the same things might be disasterous for other people. Its natural to have differences of opinion so you have to take every comment with a grain of salt.

Do you believe everything you read?

That being said,

After Pyackel gave me his "evidence" to back up his position...Leopardess is right, I was mostly asking if anyone else had an opinion on the subject. In the end of course I'm going to do what I think is best, whether everyone on the board agrees with me or not right?? They're my fish to care for...they're my responsibility.

(btw I was not having a bad day that day until someone decided to tell me I was doing something completely wrong and not offer any advice how to deal with it correctly in their opinion. I don't take kindly to asking for advice and then getting told I'm doing something wrong before I even did anything.)

 

[Leopardess]

pyackel, I said that because I meant that it didn't matter in the sense that if you were right, you were right. If you were wrong, you were wrong. Basically, it doesn't matter because you gave your advice with some proof to back it up and froggy will take that as she may...get what I'm saying...? Its up to her if she wants to follow through with that course of action...whether that action is "right" or not.


So...how bout we all just SIMMA DOWN NA! (that was a little SNL humor for all of you who are not familar so simmer down now!)