Need Help getting the correct medicine for ick

[saltwater84]

hi, I'm new to saltwater as well as this website. I just got my tank setup for about two week now and I am encountering alot of problems. The water seem murky, red alage keep on grow the rock, fish constantly have ick and seem like it cannot be cure by the ick medicine I bought from the store. Could anymore please help me.

My tank is 20 gallons
cure lives rocks and sand from established tank
light are turn on about 9-10, two filter penguin 150 and 200 runing at same time. I use cycle to help generate more bacteria inorder to help my tank mature faster. Feed my fish twice a day.
I have 1 small blue tang, 1 damsell, 1 raccon butteryfly(the size of three fingers combined), one yellow tang(same size as the butterfly), 1 black and white strip angelfish (little bit smaller than the buttery, very sick, cover with ick or ich, white little spots all around its body and fins rotton), and one koran angel.

All my fish are infected with ich or ick (whatever it is called) Can you professional guys point me to the right direction or step in curing my fishes. I really need your help. Thank you!!

 

[wayne]

OK, where to begin, and not sound harsh.

Most importantly, most of the fish you have, in fact all exccept the damsel are totally unfit to be kept in a 20. In fact they will not do well in anything below a 75 gallon tank - the tangs, the angels and the butterfly all get big, are active fish, and are very demanding of water quality. Even if they didn't get ich, they would soon die in a small tank like this.

Secondly, you have a new tank, with live rock (good) but it soundsl ike it is still maturing. It soundslike you already have run away algae problems. The answer to some of your problems is goign to be a good protein skimmer (not a seaclone or prism!), or big water changes, but frankly a bigger tank is in order for your fish. You need to learn how to keep easy fish in a good enviroment rather than what you're doing now.

OK - ick. Ick is a disease, poor water conditions and overcrowding make fish moresusceptible to it by weakening their immune systems. again almost all the fish you have are prone to getting this diesease. There are only two reliable treatemnts for it - copper and hyposalinity. And your tangs and angelfish are not likely to do well with copper treatment, so it means hypo, reducing the salinity of your water by over a half to 1.010 (which needs to be measured accurately NOT with a swing arm hydrometer). If you do this in a tank with live rock you may damage the live rock. You can google hyposalinity in this page and others for more details.
None of the 'reef safe' ick cures can be demonstrated to work - I think they're trickery, and ineffective. That includes rid-ich, kick-ick et al. Copper is most effective, but will destroy your live rock, and you need to take your sand out, and to boot some of your fish are snsitive.

In all honesty I think your fish will die. The overcrowding has likely left them too weak to be able to withstand treatment. I think you need to accept this has happened, why it has happened, and continue your tank with far more sensible fish choices. And tell whoever advised you to get these fish , that they are fools.

 

[OCCFan023]

didnt see this thread, I responded to the other one you made....

 

[RockingCricket]

You said you've had your tank set up for about two weeks now? If so, please please please do some research into this hobby. A system 2 weeks old should barely have had a clean up crew added yet, let alone tangs, angels and butterflies.

If you have just begun your system then the red algae bloom are probably diatoms and are to be expected (and are also the least of your worries). I suspect that you used conditioned tap water when you filled your aquarium. If so, this is the likely cause of the diatom bloom and conducting future water changes with RO water will stop you fueling the problem.

 

[saltwater84]

Will UV sterilizer help treat or eliminate the ick

As of today, my black and white angel die. My blue tang which I had for a little bit over two weeks now seems to be cover with tiny crystal all around its body and breathing heavly. The yellow tang and the rest of the fishes seem to be fine, looks like the ick is going away with the medicine I use (quick cure). I now have 4 fishes in my 20 gallons, the butterfly, junvelle koran angel, and the damsell. I move the little blue tang into my 5 gallons tank which had been set up for a month now. Since I have been told that ick cannot be completely cure with medicine except for copper treatment, I did some research and decided to buy a uv sterilizer to treat the ick since I put quite a investment on my tanks. I know that it is bad to use a uv sterilizer on new tank but I though since having the cure live sand and live rock for two week now benetifical bacterias has been well established. Could someone who had this experience or something relating to this help me out. Am I again making a big mistake again or what??? Anyways thank you guys for taking the time to help me out, I appreicate it!!!

 

[shwnicus]

hi again, I too hit your other thread. a UV sterilizer also will not cure anything, they just can help control spikes in free-floating organisms. once the "ick" has infected the fish, the UV sterilizer will do nothing to help that fish, unless the fish itself goes through the sterilizer (which I wouldn't recommend ).

I'm going to back up here what I said in your other thread, if your LFS is stocked with good people, bag the fish and take them there. they have a much better chance of saving these fish than you do. the tang will not survive in the 5 gal for more than a week or two. other than your damsel, your choices of fish are poor for a 20 gal. butterflies, tangs, and angels ALL require swimming room or they will stress and die. and you've got a lot more going on than just stress. and from experience, I would not keep a damsel in a tank this small unless it was by itself. they are aggresive little bastards that will attack anything (and i mean anything) once it establishes a territory, which in a tank this small is the entire tank.

again, I am not trying to be rude or mean, but you have doomed this tank from the start with poor preparation. you are, for lack of a better term, behind the cycle now and will likely not be able to recover. even if your fish were to survive all this, you will constantly fight with this tank. better to give the fish to someone who may be able to save them, break down the system, and start over. do your research first, plan your strategy, read read read and this time TAKE IT SLOW. to paraphrase someone in here's signature "nothing good happens quickly in a SW tank".

 

[S.Reef]

I politely take a few steps back and go to the next thread.

 

[SALTY WATERS]

Here is an article on "ICH" that you can read:

http://www.liveaquaria.com/general/general.cfm?general_pagesid=78

And as people have already stated your tank is overstocked! Please do yourself and your tank a favore... slow down, be patient, reaserch and reaserch some more!!!

 

[aresgod]

wow....moving on.

 

[wayne]

I don't think a UV will help - it will only kill what goes thro it, which in a closed system like yours is simply not enouh of the total water. They work well on shop, inline systems where all the water passes thro' preiodically. Also most, if not all hobbyist systems are not strong enough to actually kill an ich tomont.

 

[saltwater84]

treatment

I though a UV sterilizer should do the trick. Uhmmm..... Anyways I don't not have the ability to set up a qt at this time because it takes too long and I can't take my fishes back either, I guess I'll rely on my luck to get my fishes to health again. Anyways thank for your help.

 

[shwnicus]

for the "germ" to be killed by the sterilizer, it has to be in water (not on the fish) that goes through the sterilzer. once on the fish, it won't go through the sterilzer, hence the sterilzer won't kill the bug that causes ick.

I though a UV sterilizer should do the trick. Uhmmm..... Anyways I don't not have the ability to set up a qt at this time because it takes too long and I can't take my fishes back either, I guess I'll rely on my luck to get my fishes to health again. Anyways thank for your help.

 

[saltwater84]

Ok, it does kill the ick bug once it mature and leave the fish body right??? A pet store owner told me that if you use a uv sterilizer, you will never see ick again, am I being decieved?? Anyways, I guess I was dumb in the start, I though that freshwater and saltwater tank are setup the same way. It turn out that saltwater is very difficult to deal with. I might just give up. I have lost the blue tang, black and white angel, and about to lose the koran angel and raccon. The koran left fin erode almost completely. The raccon has many white crystal like little cube on its body. It kind of sad looking at your fishes died one by one. I have not yet recieved my Coral life UV sterilizer, it should be here tomorrow, I hope that this will help save my fishes since I had try my best to save them. I had use quick cure, melafix, and kordon prevent ich and still my fishes are dying. Is melafix safe to use if you have snails and crabs in your tank??? I guess it all up to luck now.

 

[aresgod]

you should return the UV....it isnt going to do anything to turn your fish around at this point.

 

[saltwater84]

I see, but will the uv sterilizer be benefitical to me if I restart over again in term of ick prevention and other parasites?? I guess my question is will it 100% prevent future ick and other parasities? I don't know, if all my fishes die, I will probably just do a reef tank where i don't have to worry about parasities and bugs. Is a reef tank much more easier to manage and will the uv sterilizer be benefical to it?? Anyways, thank you for time and help.

 

[OCCFan023]

I though that freshwater and saltwater tank are setup the same way. I.

problem 1, two totally different worlds that need there own research

 

[OCCFan023]

I see, but will the uv sterilizer be benefitical to me if I restart over again in term of ick prevention and other parasites?? I guess my question is will it 100% prevent future ick and other parasities? I don't know, if all my fishes die, I will probably just do a reef tank where i don't have to worry about parasities and bugs. Is a reef tank much more easier to manage and will the uv sterilizer be benefical to it?? Anyways, thank you for time and help.

no item is going to toally prevent a disease only proper care and maintence of your tank and fish will hopefully prevent an ich outbreak. The ich you have now didnt occur because you didnt have a UV steralizer it happened because of lack of planning and over crowding, even with a uv steralizer youd probably be in the same boat as you are now.

Also if you do start over and do "just a reef tank" to try and avoid infections and such you are mistaking. Corals reefs are suspetible (sp?) to disease in imporoper conditions just as your fish are.

A reef tank is not easier than a FOWLR tank which you have now (somewhat.) It requires hard work, dedication, and above all knowledge that you acquire from planning and researching.

Before you anything with this tank in the future (wether it be a FOWLR or reef) you need to do your hw and prepare instead of trying it on a whim.

We all make mistakes and I hope this can be turned into a learning experience that will provide you with insight to do what is right and research. Dont give up and dont go down the same road you did with this tank and these fish.

 

[saltwater84]

As of today, I had lost my little koran angel, little blue tang, raccon butterfly, and black and white angel. I had these fishes for two week and they were doing fine. I can't believe it, they were goine within three days. A mistake that I had learned which cost me about 100 dollars. The only fishes that survive are my yellow tang and damsell. The damsell looked all raggy and don't know how long he will survive. UV sterilizer will arrive tomorrow, TOOOOO LATE!!!!!!!! For any beginer, Please don't rush!

 

[aresgod]

again, even if you had had the UV sterilizer it would nothave made adifference,....send itback.

 

[wayne]

Agree , send it back. It cannot be effective against ich on a home system as it only kills what goes thro it, and a significant proportion of the swimming bug DOESN'T go thro', plus the low pressure UV systems sold to hobbyists simply aren't strong enough to kill ich.

If you decide to continue with salt then the new marine aquaria by Mike Paletta is a good 20 buck cheap. You are learning about the hard end of salt at this point I'm afraid.

Nothing you mentioned as a med had any hope, chance of ever helping with ich. Basically your store owner is either deceiving you, or talking out his backside