Stupid Petsmart

colesea

Superstar Fish
Oct 22, 2002
1,612
0
0
NY USA
#21
Antwan, ich is a primarily stress related disease due to improper tank maintanance. Certain fish are definately more prone to it than others, and certainly every aquarist has battled ich at some point in time, but if tank conditions are tip-top for the particular speices they house, then they should not die of ich. All fish carry ich, just like all humans carry staph, but the organisms only reach disease potential when the immune system of the host is compromised in some fashion. You could blame it on purchasing unhealthy fish from the start, but most fish, even if purchased covered with ich, can be medically treated to full health by the dedicated aquarist. Increasing salinity in a freshwater tank would be a good remedy for ich infested Columbinan catsharks, perhaps combined with some Quick-cure malicate green treatment and daily water changes to remove free-swimming larval stages that hatch off. It is the getting them to feed part that's a bit difficult, but most fish will respond to fresh foods, (ie thawed frozen stuff), even when sick, and water quality of course should be drinkable. The fact that your fish died all around the same time is an indication of a suspect tank upset, either from cycling or from some drastic stress factor such as sudden ammonia spiking or extream temperature fluctuations. Columbian sharks are too delicate a species for an un-cycled tank, and should only be added to an aquarium with fully established biofiltration and stablized chemistries. Even then, transport stress is a good cause of ich in a skiddish species, and fish like that should be maintained in a q-tank before introduction to the main population.

The theories of convergent and divergent evolution does not apply to domesticated animals. Certainly humans have twisted the "form fitting function" theory of adaptation to suit their own aestetic pleasures. Such is the case with brachycephalic canines, like pugs, which are breed with pushed in faces that mimic the face of a human, at the expense of the dog's ability to breath comfortably and eat properly. Centuries of unnatural selective breeding is what produced the domestic canine, whos only predator is the combustion engine. When compared to the wild wolf, cyote, or jackle (the three ancesteral canine lines from which it is believed domestic dogs arrose from), domestic canines:

1) live longer: The average life-span of a domestic dog, depending upon breed, is 15-20 years for toys, and 9-15 years for medium and large breeds. The averagel life-span for a grey wolf in the wild is believed to be 6 - 10 years while in captivity they have been known to reach 20 years.

2) have greater litter survival: Almost 99% of all puppies born to a domestic dog reach adulthood, compared to perhaps the 10% of all wild born wolf pups.

3) less parasite load and disease: Routine preventive medicine contributes to the health of domestic canines. All wild animals carry some parasites which at any moment are prepared to take advantage of a compromised immune system.

4) live less stressful lives: Domestic canines do not suffer droughts, famines, domanice battles, extreamly cold winters, extreamly hot summers, nor do they have to hunt, migrate, maintain territory, evade predators, contend with environmental polution and habitat loss, or in many cases even rear puppies. All these things are considered stress factors, and wild wolves are assulted with them on a daily basis, which contributes to immune system compromise and shorter life spans.

I could go on and on, but I think I've made the point clear. Domesticated animals, and even wild animals kept in captivity, usually fair much better, live longer, and are healthier, than their brethern in the wild. Of course, doing all of the above primarily depends upon how well they are cared for by the individual responsible for their husbandry. I probably should've compared domestic bettas to wild bettas, it would make the same point.

Not all flying lizards are equal, and the point you bring up is the Darwin theory of divergent evolution (aka the Galapagos finches), which does not apply in domestication, nor has anything to do with the comparison of domestication vs wild survival rates. Even if you wish to state, of course, that a pacu in the wild will grow larger and live longer than a pacu in an aquarium, you need to then remove the "stupid, novice aquarist" factor. Pacu kept in major aquariums that have their every wish catered to definately live longer and grow larger than wild pacu, and certainly fair better than the pauc in a 55 gallon home tank. Also, pacu bred in captivity will have greater fry survival than wild pacu, where 95% of the fry never reach adulthood due to predation or environmental factors.
~~Colesea
 

#22
I have a theory about my ich problem...I think that one the plants or fish from Wal-Mart had ich on it. Cause I noticed that my fish were heavily infested with Ich. They had all the signs and symptoms. The very next day I bought treatment, unfortunately, the treatment wasn't of sufficient quality. I followed every trick. Adding salt to the water (1 tblsp. per 10 gal.), raising the temp (80 F), frequent water changes (once a day max.), lowering the light levels, make sure there was water agitation, took out the filter, etc. I was just too late. I think Wal-Mart has a central filtration system that filters all the tanks, and when one "ich fish" was introduced, it was only a matter of time before several were infested and I just happen to get one of them.

Sorry colesea, I don't know why I brought up the flying lizard crap, I was tired, maybe it will occur to me later. But I could do dogs; I'm just saying that I know theres some gene in a wolf that says " I got to be better than the biggest dog!" while the domesticated stool eater is saying " Who cares!!" That survival thing makes a lot of sense, I agree. But that just tells you that the wilds have to be way ahead of domesticateds' on their survival game. If you throw a domesticated Malamute in the wilds of Alaska, I guarantee it that the wolves are gonna beat the Malamute in every possible way!
 

colesea

Superstar Fish
Oct 22, 2002
1,612
0
0
NY USA
#23
You definately have never wrestled with 70lbs of husky that wants to take your face off have you? Never, never, never underestimate the intelligence of a domesticated dog. Trust me, they are more than well aware of what dominace means, and Dakota was going to tell all five of us exactly who was top dog. But after he came out of anastesia, he sang so beautifully and looked just so pitiful, that I forgave him for throwing me halfway across the clinic.

Different dog breed have different "intelligent quotas." Labs and golden retrivers, yeah, they are definately dumb dogs. But humans have bred them that way, to be what is called "people oriented." Indeed, they have been "dumbed down" in a canine sense to make them more tractable and easier to manage. Most Malamutes and huskies are bred to be more "dog oriented." They must learn to function in a pack, where pulling the sled is a pack effort and where the pack leader must maintain control in order that they work together. If you've ever spoken with a musher, they will tell you, the dogs themselves pick who leads, and you don't dare upset that order. The only reason that the pack obeys the musher is because that human has established themself as "Alpha" dog in the pack.

Dakotan definately did not see four vet techs and a doctor as alpha anythings. He was looking at us as lunchmeat. Dominace is a very subtle thing, and cues you aren't even aware of communicate to your pet dog whether or not they are alpha of your pack. A dog that is secure in the alpha position has no reason to care because there is no challenge. Every time you let your pet dog get away with murder (jump on the couch, steal food off the counter, etc), you are sending it the subliminal message that it is the alpha of your pack, and that it is better than you are, so it doesn't need to defend itself.

Feral domestic dogs fair quite well for themselves in the wild, and I don't doubt that a determined Malamute can give a wolf a run for its money. My best friend's malamute regularly beats the crap out of her Great Dane, which is twice her height and double her weight. Because she is so low to the ground, the Malamute will actually go after the Dane's feet and pull them out from under her, then straddle her in dominace until the Dane crawls away with tail tucked. It all depends upon how the dog was raised. If it was raised to be a mushy, soft, "city" dog, then yeah, it might not have enough "dog orientation" to know how to defend itself, or even that it is a dog itself. A malamute raised as a working pack dog would have more survival instinct and higher prey drive, which would make its changes of survival much better.
~~Colesea
 

#24
Yeah, I read that one Jack London book. What was it called? j/k Anyway, I see where your coming from though. There is a lot of factors involved that determine the dogs personality. I love dogs, I'm even setting up a home for a Pit bull terrier from Atlanta right now. I see your pretty knowledgable about dogs too, were you a vet or somthin? And I see that the Malamute beats the Dane down? I thought those Danes were pretty tough. Them being bred for war and all. But she probably spoiled the dog too much I would assume.

Thank you for debating with me. :)
 

colesea

Superstar Fish
Oct 22, 2002
1,612
0
0
NY USA
#25
I'm in school right now to be an LVT, which is the same as a nurse practictioner, but for animals. Some of the people I've worked with have been dog trainers and behaviorist who help me understand how to communicate in an animal' "language". You learn how to re-direct your eye contact so that a stare isn't percieved as a threat. How to angle your body so you don't do a threatening head on approach. How to introduce yourself to an animal by allowing them to approach you first instead of the other way around. How to touch them, and where certain animals prefer to be handled. To to walk quietly and keep all your motions smooth and with as little jerking and sound as possible. Even the sound of your voice, modulating the pitch and tone, can either calm or upset an animal.

The Malamute was already established in the household before the Dane arrived. Usually it is the female dog who is the more territorial and protective, so the Malamute was none too happy when this huge awkward puppy started to trample the place. So the dominace began at day one, when the Dane was just a baby and not as big. The Dane already knows she's bottom dog, although she will challenge the Malamute now that she's a bit older and kinda feeling her strength.

But just like you can't judge a human by race, you can't judge an animal by breed. Breeds such as pit bulls and rotties have bad reputations because people haven't researched the perticular quirks of that breed. Most of the pit bulls I've met are completely mushy dogs, are just the type who think they are lap dogs and would rather drown you in saliva than bite you. But they are also very protective, one person dogs, that are bred to be independant thinkers. Mushy pit bulls are mushy because it has been reinforced in them since puppyhood that they are not the alpha dog. They also bond very closely with their person, relying on that person to be pack leader. Any threat to that person, even by a friend of the indivudual, is a threat to the pack that the pit bull will be wary of unless it is properly introduced and made to understand the new individual is also pack as well as dominate. Another breed trait of pit bulls is that they very often develop seperation anxieties, being as how they get so attached to an individual they cannot bare to be away from them for long.

My best friend's Dane hates strange men, utterly hates strange men, but loves my best friend's husband. It took a long time for Sabrita to accept my boyfriend visiting them, and she had to approach him on her own when she was ready. If we had tried to force him on her, he probably would've gotten bit. It was so cute, he was sitting on the couch, minding his own business, and Sabrita was watching and growling at him from the kitchen. Little by little as the day went on, she would creep out of the kitchen, streach herself out to sniff him, and by the end of the evening she was sitting on the couch next to him with her head in his lap, and she never had a problem with him after that.

Many dog bites result in a miscommunication, more often than not on the human's part. They also result from owners who do not understand the personally of the breed they choose, as well as the indvidual personally of their dog. My boyfriend's dog is very selective about whom he likes. It is odd, but Jack is not everybody's friend, even though he is the friendliest dog to those he has made a part of the "inner circle." I will never forget the day I went to visit my boyfriend at his clinic. I walked in, but he wasn't there. Jack comes racing down the hallway to see who entered, stopped mid-way, and stared at me. I said, "Hiya Jack-jack, how's my baby," and crouched down. He got all wriggly like a puppy, his tail going into wiplash mode, then ran up to me and lavished me with his tongue. Heather, the LVT on duty at the time, pokes her head outside the exam room and looked at me. We'd never met before, but her first words were, "Oh, Jack likes you, so you must be good people." But Jack has to be locked up when office hours begin.

Personally the only reason I think Jack likes me is because I know the way to a canine's heart is to bribe him with food *wink*.
 

RogerL

Medium Fish
Mar 13, 2003
86
0
0
Raleigh, NC
Visit site
#27
Well guys, I'm no fan of the big guys (our local Wal Marts are terrible!), but I have to say that the two PetSmart's that are closest to me are both pretty good.

I have very rarely seen a dead or distressed fish. I think that it basically comes down to the quality of the staff. My local guys seem pretty good - I have been particularly inpressed with the quality of their plant knowledge. On numerous occasions I have heard them dissuading an over-enthusiastic customer from an inappropriate purchase.