What do i do??

Nov 15, 2005
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Port Dover Ontario
#1
i am hoping for a SW tank for christmas this year. my dad was looking at a 60gl tank it has top lighting he would get all the things you need powerheads skimmer heater all that stuff but i was wondering what i have to do after that?? i was thinking on putting the sand and cured live rock in as soon as i get it and then cycle it with some cheap fish like a clown or a damsel would this work and give me some info on what wouls be the best decision! Thx you for all that help me
 

CAPSLOCK

Elite Fish
Jul 19, 2004
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#2
A damsel tends to be a bad choice to cycle with... they are very aggressive when they get bigger and I've heard they are impossible to get out without removing all your rock (and I believe it, having tried to get a royal gramma out...). You should just be able to leave the rocks in there, then gradually build up your clean up crew and slowly (very slowly) add fish. Plan on probably not getting a fish in there for at least a few months. Then start with the least aggressive/most hardy ones and work from there.
 

Nov 15, 2005
449
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Port Dover Ontario
#3
yeah i was maybe thinking of getting a clown to start off but i was thinking of putting in fish first to start the cycle quiicker i will start off with the cleanup crew but just add maybe 1 clown for atleast 1 month then slowly start stockin does that sound good?
 

Jan 16, 2004
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Syracuse, NY
#5
Cycling in saltwater is different from freshwater.

Its establishing bacteria on the rock and sand that you would want... I was fishless for about 2 months but got inverts maybe less than a month in.

Any plans on keepin corals or going fish only? I reccomend purchasing RO or RO/DI water... its purified and takes away the nutrients so things like algae dont grow, etc.
 

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Pure

Elite Fish
Nov 1, 2005
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Jacksonville, FL
#8
Mushroomman said:
Cycling in saltwater is different from freshwater.

Its establishing bacteria on the rock and sand that you would want... I was fishless for about 2 months but got inverts maybe less than a month in.

Any plans on keepin corals or going fish only? I reccomend purchasing RO or RO/DI water... its purified and takes away the nutrients so things like algae dont grow, etc.
emmm, But isn't that exactly what you do by adding ammonia to a fresh water tank for fishless cycling??
 

1979camaro

Ultimate Fish
Oct 22, 2002
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San Ramon, CA
#12
it will work to do a fish cycle but it is cruel and pointless...you end up buying a fish you don't want which may very well likely die during the process simply to start something which will already take place when you add the LR. i suggest you read up on the fundamentals of a marine tank before you get involved. rather than getting a 60 which may or may not suit your needs how about ask dad for a couple good books instead: new marine aquarium and consciencious marine aquarist are both great starters
 

aresgod

Superstar Fish
Jan 14, 2004
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#14
there is no point to using a fish, it wont speed up your cycle any faster than using LR would...its just a waste of your money...no offense but from your questions it sounds like you need to be doing more reading and put off buying the tank until you have a solid grasp on the fundamentals...invest in some good books, the ones camaro listed would be fine...I have a feeling the sources you have are inadequate.
 

#15
As much as I would like to get a saltwater tank for myself, I have many considerations to take in. Being in the Marines I travel a lot, so establishing environments and the breaking them down is a regular. I feel that I will only fulfill my saltwater craving later on in life. I think that a fishless cycle in SW and/or FW is best, because as others stated. once you use the hardy fish to cycle the tank, how does that ned up changing your scheme. Fishless seems to work for me, but I tend to have filter media already established and then just transplant as I move. The bacteria is always built up and cycling takes less time for my wife and I!
 

CAPSLOCK

Elite Fish
Jul 19, 2004
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#16
Can you add ammonia (like a FW fishless cycle) to a SW tank? I would think that would kill off the LR pretty well... Plus LR tends to come with much of the bacteria, so it isn't as long a wait as a new FW tank.
 

Pure

Elite Fish
Nov 1, 2005
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Jacksonville, FL
#17
See that is where it gets confusing. ALL fish create ammonia just thru their respiration, then there is the build up of food, and waste from the fish. All of this creates ammonia. So how can adding some to compensate for not having any fish be any different than having fish? And since ammonia is something that is going to come into the tank one way or the other how can it possibly (in small quantities just like you would use for a fishless cycle) hurt the live rock?
 

wayne

Elite Fish
Oct 22, 2002
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#18
OK Freshwater boys, obviously the nitrogen cycle is similar in freshwater to salt. Ammonia -> nitrite ->nitrate, and we usually go one stage further -> nitrogen gas , which is a step usually omitted from freshwater (plants and water changes get you out of trouble).

But here's where the similarity stops. You can actully just cycle a salt tank like fresh, but nobody , or not many people have bothered doing that since about 1990. Because we just buy all our bacteria in by putting live rock in the tank. By adding live rock not only do you add a fantastic filter material but also huge amounts of microfauna including a full suite of filter bacteria, already establisehed on the liverock. It is perfectly possible (though I wouldn't recommend it 100%) to setup a tank of water , heat it , let it settle, go to the shops a couple days later, buy xxx kilos of live rock, add it, give it a day or so to settle and get stocking. You'll get algae problems down the road, but the tank is effectively cycled, or well on the way, when the liverock goes in there.

The typical route B with liverock is to buy it 'uncured' so lots of stuff is still going to be dying/rotting on it, and let all that act as the source of ammonia.

Salt setup is very different to fresh- the principles are the same, but the practice/methods are not.
 

CAPSLOCK

Elite Fish
Jul 19, 2004
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#19
Pure, yeah I know that fish create ammonia, but in fishless cycling you go up to 5ppm of ammonia. That amount is generally toxic to fish very quickly, so that's why I wondered if you could add that much without killing off the LR.
 

wayne

Elite Fish
Oct 22, 2002
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#20
I'm not sure why you'd be adding ammonia artificially anyway, but I would agree 5 ppm of ammonia is pretty heavy going for many of the desirable things on your liverock