Iggy’s Tank Cycle Recipe
- Thread starter Iggy
- Start date
Water changes are the main way to lower nitrate levels. Plants lower levels on a constant basis in your tank, but you will still need to do water changes. For instance...during a fishless cycle your nitrates will probably get up over 100ppm before the water change at the end. Then during normal operation of the tank...your nitrites might go up to 20ppm after 10 days...while if you have plants...it might only go up to 10ppm. Either way...you need water changes to control nitrates and supply the tank with trace elements it needs.
going point!
Excellent point Iggy. I certainly have been very impatient with the 2nd step in this process. But I can see how imperative it is to continue to provide ammonia throughout the process. I have only recently found that my ammonia was dropping off to zero and I had to start adding it again, since my nitrites have went off the scale.
I certainly want to take advantage of the benefits of this process so that when I am able, I can stock my tank at least 1/2 full, otherwise all this effort would be for nothing!! Any ideas about this "Bio-Spira" stuff? I read that it's used to seed tanks but is it supposed to be refridgerated or what? I have never used it...and I am getting the sense that there's no point in using Stress Zyme either...
btw- my tank is still cloudy as hell, is it ever going to clear up?
nitrites off the scale
nitrates 80ppm
ammonia .25 -.5ppm
Excellent point Iggy. I certainly have been very impatient with the 2nd step in this process. But I can see how imperative it is to continue to provide ammonia throughout the process. I have only recently found that my ammonia was dropping off to zero and I had to start adding it again, since my nitrites have went off the scale.
I certainly want to take advantage of the benefits of this process so that when I am able, I can stock my tank at least 1/2 full, otherwise all this effort would be for nothing!! Any ideas about this "Bio-Spira" stuff? I read that it's used to seed tanks but is it supposed to be refridgerated or what? I have never used it...and I am getting the sense that there's no point in using Stress Zyme either...
btw- my tank is still cloudy as hell, is it ever going to clear up?
nitrites off the scale
nitrates 80ppm
ammonia .25 -.5ppm
I have never used Bio-Spira - and the only thing I have ever heard about it is heresay.. which means.. I really don't know enough about it to give anyone an educated answer.
I am always a little skeptical of the idea of bateria in a bottles, since the bacteria needs oxygen and constant food source to stay alive. I wonder if perhaps the bio-spira acts more like a growth booster or additive than actually containing the two kinds of nitrifying bacteria.
If your water is still cloudy, its just likely from your Flourite. You will need to turn your filter off for the evening. Don't worry, your bio-cycle bacteria can survive a night without filtration. It should clear up overnight.
I am always a little skeptical of the idea of bateria in a bottles, since the bacteria needs oxygen and constant food source to stay alive. I wonder if perhaps the bio-spira acts more like a growth booster or additive than actually containing the two kinds of nitrifying bacteria.
If your water is still cloudy, its just likely from your Flourite. You will need to turn your filter off for the evening. Don't worry, your bio-cycle bacteria can survive a night without filtration. It should clear up overnight.
Iggy,
I have been thinking about using Jungle Labs "Clear Water" which is basically just a diluted Potassium Permanganate to clear up the water in my tank. I'm sure it can be the Fluorite becuase it's been at least two weeks since I introduced it! It must be bacteria in my (still cycling?) tank. I know that Potassium Permanganate kills of biological parasites (I use it to soak all my live plants in before planting in my tank to kill of snail eggs, Ich, etc). So I guess it would kill off everything else in my tank too.
I have turned off the filtration and we'll see what happens (I am skeptical but trust in your wisdom!). I can barely see throught to the back of the tank!
As far as the Bio-Spira is concerned it is the actual bacteria in some kind of patented medium (which must be kept refridgerated) that keeps them alive. Evidently it works because the LFS where I got mine had a mini-fridge with it in there and they were told that it would be good for a minimum of 6 months! refridgerated....
And, it worked in my other tank perfectly.
I have been thinking about using Jungle Labs "Clear Water" which is basically just a diluted Potassium Permanganate to clear up the water in my tank. I'm sure it can be the Fluorite becuase it's been at least two weeks since I introduced it! It must be bacteria in my (still cycling?) tank. I know that Potassium Permanganate kills of biological parasites (I use it to soak all my live plants in before planting in my tank to kill of snail eggs, Ich, etc). So I guess it would kill off everything else in my tank too.
I have turned off the filtration and we'll see what happens (I am skeptical but trust in your wisdom!). I can barely see throught to the back of the tank!
As far as the Bio-Spira is concerned it is the actual bacteria in some kind of patented medium (which must be kept refridgerated) that keeps them alive. Evidently it works because the LFS where I got mine had a mini-fridge with it in there and they were told that it would be good for a minimum of 6 months! refridgerated....
And, it worked in my other tank perfectly.
I'm also thinking of getting a stronger filter than the one I currently have, do you think that might help? I'm considering running the new one with the old one for a week or so and then taking the smaller one off...is this the best method or can I just switch them both immediately (which sounds like complete lunacy, I know, but I don't know if it is possible or not so...) ?
Well your choices are basically to do a fishless cycle or a fish-in cycle. The first post in this thread details how to cycle a tank using the fishless method which most of us say is "better" because there aren't fishy lives in danger like there are when you do a fish-in cycle.
The hands down best way to do it would be to find a retailer near you that carries biospira...a product that will instantly cycle your tank. It has to be refrigerated, then you have to use it exactly as on the package.
The hands down best way to do it would be to find a retailer near you that carries biospira...a product that will instantly cycle your tank. It has to be refrigerated, then you have to use it exactly as on the package.
First off i just want to say hello to the myfishtank.net community. I just registered and plan to spend a lot of time reading here!
This was an awesome read. This is the first time ive been on any fish board and am a complete newb to the whole fish hobby. Im planning on getting a 30-50 gal tank as my first tank.
I think this should get me started on prepping the tank. In the meantime i can research what type of plants and fish i want to harbor. I def want live plants and obv. live fishies!
One newb question: where do the ammonia->nitrite bacteria come from? When im starting a tank, i just put in rocks and water....where does the ammonia eating bacteria get introduced? Are they impregnated in the filter?
Also, I was also looking at this tank:
44 Gallon Fish tank w/TONS of EXTRAS!
Would this be considered a good deal? I would prob offer him $150.
Thanks in Advance.
This was an awesome read. This is the first time ive been on any fish board and am a complete newb to the whole fish hobby. Im planning on getting a 30-50 gal tank as my first tank.
I think this should get me started on prepping the tank. In the meantime i can research what type of plants and fish i want to harbor. I def want live plants and obv. live fishies!
One newb question: where do the ammonia->nitrite bacteria come from? When im starting a tank, i just put in rocks and water....where does the ammonia eating bacteria get introduced? Are they impregnated in the filter?
Also, I was also looking at this tank:
44 Gallon Fish tank w/TONS of EXTRAS!
Would this be considered a good deal? I would prob offer him $150.
Thanks in Advance.
First of all, welcome to the Tank! 
This is an excellent question. *thumbsups I've wondered about this many times myself. I don't think filters come with such bacteria on them (I would, in fact, bet large sums of money on that). I can only guess that there are always small numbers of such bacteria in water and on surfaces around us that are waiting for sources of ammonia and nitrite to exploit. But, I've never heard a good explanation from a source I trust.
Seems like a good deal to me. The tank and stand are the biggies. I would ask about the lighting. Since you say you want plants, I'd try to get at least 70 or 80 watts of lighting above; higher is better, as that appears to be a tall tank. The filter might be a little old, but I don't see why it shouldn't work. I also note that there's no mention of a heater. And, since the tank is empty, you will need to cycle it; but, you seem prepared for that!
This is an excellent question. *thumbsups I've wondered about this many times myself. I don't think filters come with such bacteria on them (I would, in fact, bet large sums of money on that). I can only guess that there are always small numbers of such bacteria in water and on surfaces around us that are waiting for sources of ammonia and nitrite to exploit. But, I've never heard a good explanation from a source I trust.
Seems like a good deal to me. The tank and stand are the biggies. I would ask about the lighting. Since you say you want plants, I'd try to get at least 70 or 80 watts of lighting above; higher is better, as that appears to be a tall tank. The filter might be a little old, but I don't see why it shouldn't work. I also note that there's no mention of a heater. And, since the tank is empty, you will need to cycle it; but, you seem prepared for that!
This is a great thread! It is a little confusing though and I have a few questions.
I am a newbie when it comes to cycling a fish tank, but going by Iggy's recipe do you have to test the Ammonia levels every 24 hours until they reach 0 ppm? Once you get o ppm we know that the first bacteria cycle is complete. Then do we continue to test Nitrite levels every 24 hours till we also get 0 ppm?
I am already have fish in my tank, but would love to set up another one and I would love to do a fishless cycle. My question is you said that after the cycle has complete you said you can add the full capacity of your tank, but wouldn't you have to worry about an Ammonia spike? Or no because all the bacteria is there to deal with that?
Last question, (sorry for all the questions) Izzy said to avoid using filter media that you have to replace or remove once you complete the cycle because once you remove the media, you loose its biological capacity. So my question is when can you remove it because aren't you suppose to remove and replace your filtration media every month?
I am a newbie when it comes to cycling a fish tank, but going by Iggy's recipe do you have to test the Ammonia levels every 24 hours until they reach 0 ppm? Once you get o ppm we know that the first bacteria cycle is complete. Then do we continue to test Nitrite levels every 24 hours till we also get 0 ppm?
I am already have fish in my tank, but would love to set up another one and I would love to do a fishless cycle. My question is you said that after the cycle has complete you said you can add the full capacity of your tank, but wouldn't you have to worry about an Ammonia spike? Or no because all the bacteria is there to deal with that?
Last question, (sorry for all the questions) Izzy said to avoid using filter media that you have to replace or remove once you complete the cycle because once you remove the media, you loose its biological capacity. So my question is when can you remove it because aren't you suppose to remove and replace your filtration media every month?
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^^ this is what i gathered after reading the thread a couple times:
A fish tank is a small biosphere. To make sure that this bioshere is healthy you need to maintain balence.
1.) In order to control the waste that the fish excretes, you need to have a balance of ammonia eating bacteria. This colony needs to be established before introducing fish or the ammonia levels will be too high in concentration for the fish to live and basically the fish die in their own wastes.
In order to establish said colony, a 5ppm level of ammonia is suggested. It seems to be a concentration that characterizes an acceptable level of fish waste in a tank. When you have a colony capable of processing a 5ppm level, you are ready for the next step.
2.) Said ammonia eating bacteria also produces wastes. Their waste is nitrite(NO2-). As more air gets introduced, Nitrite forms nitrate (NO2- to NO3-). In order to control nitrate levels you need to change the water.
I gather that the concentration of nitrate either a.) has a higher concentration threshold for the fish to survive or b.) the rate of generation of nitrate is a lot lower than the rate of generation of ammonia, therefore its more efficient to "condition" the water rather than change it whenever the ammonia level are too high (expensive for 50+ gallon tanks).
Please correct me if im wrong, its the best way for me to learn.
A fish tank is a small biosphere. To make sure that this bioshere is healthy you need to maintain balence.
1.) In order to control the waste that the fish excretes, you need to have a balance of ammonia eating bacteria. This colony needs to be established before introducing fish or the ammonia levels will be too high in concentration for the fish to live and basically the fish die in their own wastes.
In order to establish said colony, a 5ppm level of ammonia is suggested. It seems to be a concentration that characterizes an acceptable level of fish waste in a tank. When you have a colony capable of processing a 5ppm level, you are ready for the next step.
2.) Said ammonia eating bacteria also produces wastes. Their waste is nitrite(NO2-). As more air gets introduced, Nitrite forms nitrate (NO2- to NO3-). In order to control nitrate levels you need to change the water.
I gather that the concentration of nitrate either a.) has a higher concentration threshold for the fish to survive or b.) the rate of generation of nitrate is a lot lower than the rate of generation of ammonia, therefore its more efficient to "condition" the water rather than change it whenever the ammonia level are too high (expensive for 50+ gallon tanks).
Please correct me if im wrong, its the best way for me to learn.
Alright, just read the next FAQ article:
http://www.myfishtank.net/articles/fishless-cycle/
The only thing i need to correct is that the no2- doesnt convert to no3- from air but another bacteria colony. A nitrite eating colony that produces nitrate as wastes. From teh article it seems that the nitrate levels both have higher fish survival threshold conc. and the generation of Nitrate (still poisonous to the fish) is slower than the rate of ammonia.
http://www.myfishtank.net/articles/fishless-cycle/
The only thing i need to correct is that the no2- doesnt convert to no3- from air but another bacteria colony. A nitrite eating colony that produces nitrate as wastes. From teh article it seems that the nitrate levels both have higher fish survival threshold conc. and the generation of Nitrate (still poisonous to the fish) is slower than the rate of ammonia.
Yeah, you've pretty much got it. *thumbsup2 The only (slight) note I would make is about the following:
5ppm of ammonia is way too high for your tank! You want to get the levels that high when you're cycling. But, if your fish ever see a tank with levels that high, they're going to be very, very sad (and sick, if not dead). You want it at 0ppm, definitely lower than 0.25ppm.
5ppm of ammonia is way too high for your tank! You want to get the levels that high when you're cycling. But, if your fish ever see a tank with levels that high, they're going to be very, very sad (and sick, if not dead). You want it at 0ppm, definitely lower than 0.25ppm.
Well, that's the thing. Most tests that people use, such as the API liquid tests that I use, are graded in levels of 0.25ppm. That is to say, it's either 0ppm or 0.25ppm.
But, it's even worse than that. Usually, you're just matching a color to a chart. So, the reading is very subjective. Yeah, you can tell for the most part. But, this scientist would rather have an objective reading with error bars!
Basically, just keep your ammonia as close to zero as you can. If your tank isn't overstocked and you're doing regular water changes, that part isn't hard.
But, it's even worse than that. Usually, you're just matching a color to a chart. So, the reading is very subjective. Yeah, you can tell for the most part. But, this scientist would rather have an objective reading with error bars!
Basically, just keep your ammonia as close to zero as you can. If your tank isn't overstocked and you're doing regular water changes, that part isn't hard.
Welcome to the tank.
This thread is stickied in a manner of speaking. You can find a permanent link to it here http://www.myfishtank.net/forum/fre...eshwater-beginner-stickies-read-me-first.html
That link is at the top of the page in this forum.
This thread is stickied in a manner of speaking. You can find a permanent link to it here http://www.myfishtank.net/forum/fre...eshwater-beginner-stickies-read-me-first.html
That link is at the top of the page in this forum.
I did not do this i am totally upset that my petshop guy didnt tell anything. he simply gave me 33 gallon tank, told me not to fill up completely, add sand ( i washed it first then added it without him telling it was good idea) then told me to add some water from bottle ( i think its declorinator + ammonia ) and then told me to put fist after 1 day. i did , my 1 + yr old fish are looking good after almost 3 days, but now i discover this and i am not feeling good.
will i loose my fish? should i take them out and put them in old small tank for another 2-3 weeks and do this process mentioned here?
please please help me fast.
i am totally upset that my petshop guy didnt tell anything. he simply gave me 33 gallon tank, told me not to fill up completely, add sand ( i washed it first then added it without him telling it was good idea) then told me to add some water from bottle ( i think its declorinator + ammonia ) and then told me to put fist after 1 day. i did , my 1 + yr old fish are looking good after almost 3 days, but now i discover this and i am not feeling good. will i loose my fish? should i take them out and put them in old small tank for another 2-3 weeks and do this process mentioned here?
please please help me fast.