Back to saltwater

[War Eagle]

Hello everyone. I've been reading for a month or so now. There are some interesting people here *twirlysmi. A little background. Back in the day I actually put myself through college at Auburn University by caring for saltwater tanks. I worked in the business office of the local hospital, which paid the bills. In the hospital we had 7 tanks ranging from 20 to 250 gallons (containing 2 spotted grouper approx 1 foot long each). Outside of the hospital I had a couple bars with tanks also, and of course I had a couple tanks at home. Well, I graduated college so the additional income and head ache was not needed so I dropped all the "pay" tanks and then came the kids so I dropped my tanks at home as well.

A couple years ago I decided the kids were old enough to enjoy the hobby so Santa brought a 10 gallon tank for christmas, freshwater. That later turned into a 14 gallon Nano Cube (great tank). Recently I built a bar in my basement and thought the cube would look great sitting on it as a SW tank. Boy does it!

Currently I have one piece of live rock and a few bio-balls and spong as my bio system (I know I'm gonna hear about that). I have some dead coral (kinda like an elk horn but blue) as structure with the LR and fine white sand as my substrate. I have three blue damsels (as you can tell I'm old school) that will be returned once I start stocking my tank for the long haul. I have been cycling about a month, everything is running smoothly so far. I have some brown and now starting to develope a little green hair-like algea.

Anyway, that's me. I look forward to talking with you about fish, football, golf, whatever.

I do have a couple statement/ questions. These damsels are destroying my tank. I smooth out my sand and within a couple hours they have dug holes down to the glass again. Do they always do this? I can understand under the rock and such but they do this against the outside wall.

My other question is: May of you harp on getting rid of the bio-balls. I understand your reasons why but I don't understand what is the difference between the bacteria the bio-ball grows and the bacteria thee LR grows. They are both surface area and they both grow bacteria. Is the bacteria in teh LR different/ more efficient?

I appologize for such a long first post but I like to talk. I look forward to your comments. By the way yall have some beautiful tanks and I will post some pics as I progress back into the SW world.

 

[Cichlid-Man]

Hello everyone.

First off, welcome to MFT...officially!

A couple years ago I decided the kids were old enough to enjoy the hobby so Santa brought a 10 gallon tank for christmas, freshwater. That later turned into a 14 gallon Nano Cube (great tank). Recently I built a bar in my basement and thought the cube would look great sitting on it as a SW tank. Boy does it!

Isn't it funny how tanks upgrade themselves like that? Mine seem to do it all the time, and keep getting larger in gallonage.

I do have a couple statement/ questions. These damsels are destroying my tank. I smooth out my sand and within a couple hours they have dug holes down to the glass again. Do they always do this? I can understand under the rock and such but they do this against the outside wall.

When i had my damsels they did this as well. I think they are like cichlids of saltwater. Always picking around the bottom looking for food and making their home how THEY want it.

My other question is: May of you harp on getting rid of the bio-balls. I understand your reasons why but I don't understand what is the difference between the bacteria the bio-ball grows and the bacteria thee LR grows. They are both surface area and they both grow bacteria. Is the bacteria in teh LR different/ more efficient?

I think one of the main concerns here is that since the bioballs have the water flowing over/through them they are acting like a filter and will trap solid wastes. Which in turn cranks up the nitrates because its not something you always clean. Thats how i've always looked at it and understood it, someone correct me if i am wrong.

Anyway, that's me. I look forward to talking with you about fish, football, golf, whatever.

Mmm i'm always down to talk about NCAA football. Unfortunately you're Tigers beat my Tigers in the Chik-Fil-A bowl last year. Eh, better then being a Gamecock i guess.

 

[epond83]

From what i know the bioballs are too efficent and turn everything into nitrates, Where as with live rock and a skimmer, the skimmer can pull out stuff before it gets broke down and what the skimmer doesn't get the live rock covnverts to nitrates which can be removed with water changes and or macro algea.

And Welcome to MFT

 

[tom91970]

Welcome to the Tank!

 

[vipers]

i use bio-balls... the main thing to understand is, if you doing a FISH ONLY tank, bioballs are fine becuase fish arent affected by nitrates(unless there is an abundant amount of it)... but reefs need 0 nitrate levels..so bioballs are the enemy..... and since very few people on this site are fish only, you wont hear very much positive things said on them....

 

[Lorna]

Welcome to MFT......just chuckling here at the comments Matt is right in what he states as the reason bioballs are frowned upon by reefers....and yes probably more on this site are reefers than fish only.....we just seem to graduate to full blown reefs over time, can't help ourselves. The hobby has changed dramatically over the years and the theory changed with the times. We don't recommend cycling with damsels as it is somewhat cruel to them.....yeah well they are damsels though, but the biggest reason is that when you get a large reef tank set up with a few hundred pounds of rock in it you really dread the thought of tearing this setup down to remove some b,,stard fish that refuses to let you add any other fish to the setup as they get very mean and territorial.

Nitrates are not a real problem with a fish only tank, the problem here is that if you want to add a cleanup crew and inverts to your tank most are also intolerable to high nitrates. So start as you mean to go........live rock will allow you to expand and add a variety of things to your tank later on down the road.....ie....corals, inverts...etc...

 

[TRe]

well matt and lorna already covered the bioball/damsel thing but welcome to MFT!

 

[War Eagle]

Thanks guys. I realize things have changed since I last had a SW tank. I'll change my ways over time. I am getting more LR this wekend and will take your advice on the bioballs.

My initial thought was to have a tank with some LR and orange and blue fish (big Auburn fan) damsels and clowns. I forgot how agressive the damsels are. Can you recommend a something to go with a couple clowns to keep my orange and blue theme going. Funny huh? More worried about color than anything. Oh well, we like what we like.

Thanks for your replies.

 

[Airborneguy]

Lol... I've been trying to get my hands on some Green Bay Packers Zoos for the same reason! I think it is a great way to plan a tank.

 

[War Eagle]

So if you found a yellow and green Zoo would that one be your Favre-orite?

So, can I assume that since everyone is reefers and the reef has no tollerance for nitrates that this is the reason for weekly water changes? I have always done this monthly, about 10%. From the info I have read hear I would assume I should change about 2 gallons a week in my 14g cube. Is this correct?

 

[quaddity]

Lol... I've been trying to get my hands on some Green Bay Packers Zoos for the same reason! I think it is a great way to plan a tank.

I have about 50-60 polyps of GBP. Maybe we can get trade some frags.

 

[Cichlid-Man]

Its to bad you have a 14g, otherwise a Flameback Angelfish or Coral Beauty might fit your color needs.

For my experience, most of my soft coral Zoas and Pallys in particular prefer a little dirt in the water. Dirt being nasty poo/food/whatever. They seem to like a nutrient rich environment. I will usually do a WC every 2 weeks in my 10gal. Unless it just going bad and i can see it then i step it up. Coral is very responsive to their environment, you can tell when something isn't right. But at the same time, things can go downhill fast especially in a small tank.

 

[Lorna]

Ahhh I have a pygmy cherub angel in my 29g that started out in a 20g....maybe pushing it to place one in a 14g, they are not that active though they do need quite a bit of live rock to pick at and can be known to nip some corals or clams. Probably would do fine with a single ocellaris .... just don't go and put an anemone in there.....

 

[War Eagle]

So finally ny old school methodes have cycled. My damsels and small LR did the trick. Yesterday I went to the LFS and had them test my water. Everything looked good except PH was alittle low and SG was a little high, easily adjusted. So I asked about a CU crew. I baught another 3 lbs of LR two turbo snails and two blue legged hermit crabs. The LR is nice, I can tell that the coralin is about to take off and there are many many holes and caves in it, I hope I get some freebees out of it. The hermits hit the ground running. They are very active and doing an incredible job of cleaning algea, I never knew they were so efficient. The snails however blazed a trail across the sand, stopped and haven't moved since. Is it normal for them to do that or did I lose them right away? I dripped them for about 2 hours prior to introducing them to the tank.

 

[Cichlid-Man]

Snails are probably fine. I find mine to be very lazy compared to the hermits.

 

[Lorna]

Turbos especially they seem to be more active at night than during the day. Sounds like all is fine though. Good luck

 

[War Eagle]

Yea, I got home from work today and one of them has moved up on the glass,so your probably right. Thanks

 

[War Eagle]

OK I have another question. I'm just going to keep using this same thread when I have questions until everything gets settled. So, I have a health does of red slime covering my sand. Reading back through some posts I see some of yall blaming phosphates and some blaming water flow. Would I have a build up of phos yet? The tank is less than 2 months old. As for flow I have two 70 gph pumps in the sump. One using the flat disperser (?) that came with the cube and the other just using 1/2 pvc pointing down and to the front of the tank. I also have a Koralia 1 in the back corner about halfway down shooting to the opposit corner.
So I wen tto the lfs store today and got some red slime destroyer and phosguard. I plan on dosing with the destroyer for a couple days then doing a 50% WC followed by the phosguard treatment. Does this sound like a plan or do you have another suggestion?

 

[Lorna]

I personally would not recommend any kind of water treatment at this point. I truly believe your problem is lack of flow. Aim for 20 to 30 times your tank volume turnover an hour. This keeps the detritus in suspension and assists the protein skimmer in removal. Do a large water change, increase your flow and ensure it is random without any dead spots. You should try and siphon as much of the slime out as you can with the water change. Reduce your lighting for a couple of days and these should help. Algae or in this case cyano bacteria blooms are common in the beginning of the set up and will come and go until your tank matures. High phosphates and nitrates also contribute to algae etc. Cut back on your feeding schedule and once you do all these things you will begin to see it start to subside. Keep siphoning it out until it is gone.

 

[Lotus]

I've heard of a lot of problems in using red slime remover chemicals in tanks less than a year old. I'd stick to flow and nutrient control to keep the red slime away.