Fish Died

Omnominator

Omnominator

Large Fish
#1
Sep 19, 2012
101
0
0
Clearwater, Fl
#1
Hello, I own a 5 gallon aquarium. I have had it for around 3 months.I do everything I am supposed to do to keep the fish alive and happy. However, today 2 of the 4 fish died. All fish are livebearers and they aren't aggressive towards each other. One was a young Swordtail and one was a Variutus Platy. These fish are the 2 slim fish of the aquarium. Would that have anything to do with there death? They were both inactive on the ground today not doing anything besides swimming up to eat. Also, I don't think it was an Ammonia spike or a Nitrite spike because the other fish have not done anything strange today. I am just curious and would like to know possible reasons of these deaths. (the swordtail died first then the platy later) Anything will be appreciated. I do not own a test kit to check the levels either.
 

O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#4
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
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36
#4
Every fish is an individual. Some fish are more sensitive to poor water quality than others.

How often and how much water do you change in the 5 gallon tank? What do you feed and how often?

When were the two now-dead fish last 'fine'?
 

O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#6
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
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36
#6
With an injured swordtail (didn't you say it was attacked by a crayfish?), two platy and a molly, 5 gallons is too small. When you overstock a tank, you must be very careful to do more water changes and test the water so you can respond quickly if things go bad.

If I were keeping those 4 fish in a 5 gallon tank on a temporary basis, I would change 50% of the water 2x a week and only feed once, every other day.

Without testing the water, is would be hard to know what caused the deaths.

You've also introduced fish you caught in your local waterway that died you said within a few hours of putting them into the tank. Without quarantining new fish, it is easy to introduce disease and parasites. The results may not be visable immediately, but it can weaken the fish, making it more prone to the affects of poor water quality.

If you cannot check the water's parameters, I would go on the assumption that there is an ammonia/nitrite spike and do daily 50% water changes, making sure to match the temperature of the new water to the tank's water.

What do you use for a dechlorinator? Some brands can be used to bind ammonia and nitrite for a few days, provided you give the tank extra aeration. The few days can help the biofilter catch up if its been established.
 

Omnominator

Omnominator

Large Fish
#7
Sep 19, 2012
101
0
0
Clearwater, Fl
#7
I've grown to know that fish are usually a lot more hardy than people give them credit for. So I understand where you are coming from with the water changes and the overstocking and such, but people do it all the time and my fish were doing great. I also understand the thing about wild fish and such but its almost the same for buying fish. You don't know where those fish have been and so on. Also, my friend has a ton of tanks and he catches over half of the fish in his tanks. I don't see how an ammonia or nitrite spike is possible if I have been doing the same thing for months. I use tetra aquasafe.
 

KcMopar

KcMopar

Superstar Fish
#8
May 11, 2011
1,854
1
0
Louisiana
www.americanhotrodsolutions.com
#8
You can speculate that you have a problem because fish died. If your water was good those two fish would probably not have died, its just an educated deduction but its likely. Some fish are tougher/stronger then others, just like people are. On person might die from a poison that another can live through. Its the same with fish, ammonia and nitrite poison them. Sudden deaths of two fish at the same time is about as likely as winning the lottery. It important to have a test kit then you know how to care properly for your pets. Just saying a spike is not possible is not fair to your pets because you dont really know for sure. They cant get away from the tank you have them in and swim to a better place. Until you get a test kit you need to do some water changes to be sure your other fish dont die to IMHO.
 

O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#9
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
0
36
#9
Omnominator said:
So I understand where you are coming from with the water changes and the overstocking and such, but people do it all the time and my fish were doing great.
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Two deaths in one day indicates that the fish were NOT doing great...

Omnominator said:
I also understand the thing about wild fish and such but its almost the same for buying fish. You don't know where those fish have been and so on.
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Wild fish, new fish from a pet store, its all the same. Anything 'new' to your aquarium should be quarantined if you don't want to spread disease/parasites to your existing fish.

Omnominator said:
I don't see how an ammonia or nitrite spike is possible if I have been doing the same thing for months.
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It is possible to have an ammonia and/or nitrite spike very easily in an overstocked tank. IMHO, with feeding 2x a day and only doing a 20% water change per week, poor water quality is likely the cause of the two sudden fish deaths in one day.

Omnominator said:
I use tetra aquasafe.
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I could not find information on Tetra's website that states if it does a temp binding with ammonia. Perhaps the bottle's directions will indicate this.
 

Omnominator

Omnominator

Large Fish
#10
Sep 19, 2012
101
0
0
Clearwater, Fl
#10
Nd this weekend Tomorrow I. Am borrowing a test kit to test water, and buying one this weekend. I didn't realize it was such a big issue. I have been doing water changes and feeding less. Is feeding 1 time a day every other day nessessary for 2 fish? I thought that I knew enough about aquariums and was one of the smarter 'noobs'. I guess not.
 

skjl47

skjl47

Large Fish
#11
Nov 13, 2010
712
0
0
Northeastern Tennessee.
#11
Hello; Of all the skills that new fishkeepers have difficulty with, feeding is perhaps the most common issue. I overfed in my early days and it took several years to learn on my own the various problems this would cause.

I now lightly feed only once a day and will skip a day or two each week with no feeding at all. Fish are cold blooded and do not metabolize like us, so can go with much less food and need fed less often.

Overfeeding in a small tank can lead to problems quickly. This is why I have tended to have larger tanks of late. A larger tank can provide a cushion against these sudden issues. Of course an overstocked large tank will face the same issues from overfeeding as a small tank.

Light feeding also helps with the rest of tank care. The water quality stays more stable over time. I would also throw in light stocking in this regard. I use to stock my tanks fairly heavy and have the last several years gone to much lighter stocking, it makes tank keeping much easier.
 

KcMopar

KcMopar

Superstar Fish
#13
May 11, 2011
1,854
1
0
Louisiana
www.americanhotrodsolutions.com
#13
Its a big learning curve when you first start for sure!!!! Realizing that you have made mistakes puts you ahead of the curve for sure. You are not doing anything different then most new aquarists have already done as well. Dont be to hard on yourself but rather work on the opportunity you now have to improve your skills and tank maintenance. A test kit will surely be a great tool for you. You will learn a lot from testing and learn how your water quality changes with time between water changes and even when you feed less/more from week to week or even see changes when you change foods to.

A 5 gallon tank is fine with just a couple small fish, IMO 4 is to many but thats just what I feel comfortable with. I have a 10G with only two small fish that are about 1.5 inches and I feel this is about all I will ever have in it. Many will say more is OK and it is for sure but I want to keep the best conditions I can for these two fish.
Your knowledge will grow exponentially in the next few weeks to months about how to keep fish health and living for many years.
 

O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#15
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
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#15
Omnominator said:
orangecones, as you can see i am new at this and dont have multiple tanks. therefore how can i quarantine new fish?
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I've used water change buckets as a quarantine container.

We all start out not knowing the proper way to care for fish. Sadly, many pet stores are just interested in selling a tank and fish and may not really know how to care for them long-term.

Just to let you know, I've been keeping fish for over 30 years now (freshwater planted tanks only now, but also kept saltwater when I lived in Florida and would catch fish while out on SCUBA trips).

My first aquarium? 10 gallons. First 3 fish in it on day 1? Two oscars and a clown knife fish. What happened to those fish? One oscar died in two weeks. The knife lost one of its eyes a month later (did not know what the cause was...attack by the oscar? disease due to poor water quality?) Two months later, they are both in a 55 gallon tank and I rehomed the knife fish to live at my dentist's office aquarium a year later. My first Oscar (named Felix) lived with me from a baby (1inch long) until 13 inches long, and almost 12 years.
 

T

Thyra

Superstar Fish
#17
Jun 2, 2010
1,891
0
0
Yelm, WA
#17
A filter isn't really a necessity as long as you vacuum and do regular water changes. Many people keep tanks without filters. The main thing I would think you would need is a heater depending on what temp you want to keep your water at. Thrift stores frequently have small tanks really cheap - the problem there is you need to be careful they aren't reptile tanks because they could leak. (The seams aren't necessarily water tight)
 

O

OrangeCones

Elite Fish
#18
Feb 27, 2009
4,395
0
36
#18
Thyra said:
the problem there is you need to be careful they aren't reptile tanks because they could leak. (The seams aren't necessarily water tight)
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A friend of mine that used to work for a place the built 'glass enclosures' (i.e. Fish Aquariums and Reptile/Amphibian Tanks) tells me its not that they are not that the seams are water tight, but that the seams and glass are not designed to withstand the pressure a full tank of water will put out. Those that are 'Reptile/Amphibian Tanks' are meant to have some dirt/plants (real or fake) and some water, but not completely full of water. The Fish version had glass 2x the thickness and a different type of sealant when made compared to the Reptile/Amphibian version. When I asked why they made them differently, I was told that it is a matter of cost. If the tank didn't need to withstand the pressure of being full of water, then it could be made with about 3/5th the price for materials. Plus the drying time was shorter, so more could be made faster.
 

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